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Post by Dizzy D on Aug 7, 2017 2:01:22 GMT -5
The actor for Valerian also looks a bit younger than he actually is (he's in his early 30s, but looks like early 20s to me).
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Post by lordyam on Aug 9, 2017 2:48:42 GMT -5
I rather liked it. Valerian and Lauraline were both likable, and the plot was engaging. It was pretty obvious Clive Owen was evil once he tortured that guy
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Post by Roquefort Raider on Aug 12, 2017 17:29:21 GMT -5
I've been watching a few youtube videos trying to explain why the movie failed. Most of them were presenting ridiculous arguments.
a) Obscure source material.
What? A movie is now made popular (or not) based on the recognizability of its source material? As Wolfgang Pauli would say, this is so out there that "it's not even wrong!"
I very much doubt that the moviegoers who made Guardians of the galaxy, Pirates of the Caribbean or A history of violence big successes were that familiar with the comics or the park rides that inspired them. People don't care about the source material. They want to be entertained by what they see on the screen, no matter where it came from.
b) Lack of big name stars.
Maybe there are people who actually go to see action CGI movies because Tom Cruise or Samuel Jackson is in them. Maybe. I just can't fathom it. That type of genre movie is exciting because of the story it tells and the outlandish things it shows. Did anyone really go see Avatar just because Sigourney Weaver was in it??? Who was famous in Star Wars apart from two supporting characters? If such people exist, they must be in the minority.
c) Nobody knew what to make of the movie because the trailer didn't make it clear.
Oh, come on!!! This is clearly a SF romp with tons of CGI, in which dashing heroes are supposed to save the world (or some world anyway). Everybody knows the score!!! We can practically recite the script just from watching the trailers!
Valerian suffered the same fate as John Carter a few years ago. A few critics, for God knows what reason, decided they didn't like it and the movie opened with bad press. That means the movie was doomed, even while equivalent (or worse) CGI-laden, action/adventure fantasy flicks were given a pass. People didn't go, and since there's one blockbuster every other week nowadays they just went to see something else instead, thinking they might catch Valerian later on Netflix.
It's a pity really. Now, more than ever, we're stuck with sequels, prequels and reboots of films that made money. That people having actually watched Valerian will say "well, it really wasn't that bad! I actually enjoyed it a lot!" is scant consolation for the producers who lost a hundred million dollars. Producers who will then have to watch Transformers XIX and Star Wars: Boss Nass rake in the money!
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Confessor
CCF Mod Squad
Not Bucky O'Hare!
Posts: 10,201
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Post by Confessor on Aug 12, 2017 19:12:17 GMT -5
Producers who will then have to watch Transformers XIX and Star Wars: Boss Nass rake in the money! There's a Boss Nass film coming out?! Awesome! I'm there. #sostoked
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Post by Deleted on Aug 13, 2017 1:11:22 GMT -5
Your post explaining the a, b, c, and other stuff about this movie makes sense to me Roquefort Raider and that's why I had problems with this movie. Honestly, I don't want to see this movie again. Sorry Everyone.
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Post by Dizzy D on Aug 17, 2017 7:35:26 GMT -5
I've been watching a few youtube videos trying to explain why the movie failed. Most of them were presenting ridiculous arguments. a) Obscure source material. What? A movie is now made popular (or not) based on the recognizability of its source material? As Wolfgang Pauli would say, this is so out there that "it's not even wrong!" I very much doubt that the moviegoers who made Guardians of the galaxy, Pirates of the Caribbean or A history of violence big successes were that familiar with the comics or the park rides that inspired them. People don't care about the source material. They want to be entertained by what they see on the screen, no matter where it came from. b) Lack of big name stars. Maybe there are people who actually go to see action CGI movies because Tom Cruise or Samuel Jackson is in them. Maybe. I just can't fathom it. That type of genre movie is exciting because of the story it tells and the outlandish things it shows. Did anyone really go see Avatar just because Sigourney Weaver was in it??? Who was famous in Star Wars apart from two supporting characters? If such people exist, they must be in the minority. c) Nobody knew what to make of the movie because the trailer didn't make it clear. Oh, come on!!! This is clearly a SF romp with tons of CGI, in which dashing heroes are supposed to save the world (or some world anyway). Everybody knows the score!!! We can practically recite the script just from watching the trailers! Valerian suffered the same fate as John Carter a few years ago. A few critics, for God knows what reason, decided they didn't like it and the movie opened with bad press. That means the movie was doomed, even while equivalent (or worse) CGI-laden, action/adventure fantasy flicks were given a pass. People didn't go, and since there's one blockbuster every other week nowadays they just went to see something else instead, thinking they might catch Valerian later on Netflix. It's a pity really. Now, more than ever, we're stuck with sequels, prequels and reboots of films that made money. That people having actually watched Valerian will say "well, it really wasn't that bad! I actually enjoyed it a lot!" is scant consolation for the producers who lost a hundred million dollars. Producers who will then have to watch Transformers XIX and Star Wars: Boss Nass rake in the money! I'll be a bit more kind to both movie and general audience: there are a lot of good movies out right now, so competion is fierce for people who only go to see 1 or 2 movies a month, so Valerian has to attract more attention than say... Dunkirk, which has a famous director or Spider-Man, which has name-recognition. Movie success and movie quality are only tenuously connected (Hello, Transformers franchise), so in a busy movie season like this you'd need something to draw attention, whether it is a director, actor, visuals, source material or something else. (Example: for me I had time for 2 movies in the cinema last month: going to the cinema takes a certain time investment that just putting on Netflix or so, doesn't. So I picked Valerian, because I love the source material and I picked Baby Driver because I love the director. I'm sure there were more great movies out there that month, but I didn't have the time to see them.) So what's there in the trailers for the vast audience unfamiliar with Valerian: not much, really. You are dismissive of point C. that the trailer was not very clear, but the trailers were just not very good for this movie. The trailers don't do any great job of selling us on the world or the relationship between the two main characters (not going into how that relationship was just so much better in the comics compared to the walking HR disaster that movie Valerian is). We get brightly coloured sci-fi environments and CGI monsters, which may draw in some, but it has been done before, quite often, so it's not a unique draw for most of the audience and we get nothing else from the trailer. A bit more of the way Valerian and Laureline work together (more attention to Laureline in general for that matter) to sell our heroes to the audience. So, we lose a lot of audience already at that point. The bit more interested potential audience member will then look into the movie a bit more: why should he or she spend money on this? We get no plotline from the trailers, just unconnected action scenes. The actors are relatively newcomers or not big names (having Rihanna as one of the big names doesn't do it any favours either). It has Luc Besson, but the Fifth Element's reception was already mixed (and that one did have a major action star in its cast) and Leon was a long time ago and a very different movie. Since then Besson hasn't made any big successes really; Lucy was mostly coasting on Scarlet Johansen's popularity. So those youtube videos you saw were not exactly wrong, but they were not completely right either: None of the points you mention are indeed the big reason why a movie has success or not, but each of those movies had other things going for it: - Guardians didn't have recognisable source material, but it had the Marvel logo that came from a string of successes, well-cut trailers that set up the premises of the movie (rag-tag band of misfits save the galaxy) and raised interest (use of older, but recnogisable music, some good jokes). Its actors were not A-list, but still relatively well known. - Pirates was a gamble, but it had relatively little competition when it came out and we were not sick of Johnny Depp yet at that point. Also it had a great cast and visuals. Again trailers set up the story well. - History of Violence: The odd duck in your list of movies. It was a critical success and it definitely made its money back, but it's smaller, more quiet movie. Drawing on the fame of its director and its major actors (it has to, because it has no amazing visuals or hook to draw on, the actors do all the heavy lifting). - Avatar: it had the 3D gimmick, which was new (well, new again) at that point and it had James Cameron, director of several of the greatest hits of all time. Like Valerian, its trailers were colourful and filled with weird aliens, but it was never the hook for that movie. - Star Wars: Star Wars success was a bit of a suprise at the time. It was a time when movies and marketing worked differently from today, Valerian is one of many sci-fi action movies released this exact summer, while Star Wars was pretty much unique at the time. Your conclusion that we therefore will only get prequels, sequels or reboots is a leap: just look at the success of The Martian or Arrival (keeping it to just sci-fi movies). Valerian underperformed for a variety of reasons; it was not a bad movie, it probably deserved better, but I also had problems with the movie, so if a critic didn't like it, I can quite understand that.
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Post by hondobrode on Aug 23, 2017 4:21:15 GMT -5
I'm with RR. I loved it and thought it was fantastic. I'd read the 3 Dargaud English translations and liked them but wasn't crazy about them. I did go nuts when I saw the trailers for this though. Part of the under-performance is the timing of what it was up against, like Dunkirk and Spider-Man.
I'd love to see this continue but it probably won't. That's horrible cause this seriously deserves to be a new franchise IMO.
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Post by jeanmichel on Aug 26, 2017 7:52:02 GMT -5
Hi ! Very interesting to read you all. I was a huge fan of "Valerian" in the 70s, when I discovered it (in French). I still own some issues. "Valerian" was very new for this period, with two characters having weaknesses and making mistakes (sometimes) - and also, from a visual point of view, it was a very new way to draw E.T. worlds. Later, I have been lucky enough to meet Jean-Pierre Christin, and he is a great guy, with many original ideas, and a never ending imagination. But I have to say that I have been a little bit deceived by the movie : it too far from the comics atmosphere, and a little bit slow, with not enough spectacular scenes. It's fun, but not fantastic.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 19, 2019 1:50:45 GMT -5
So very late to the party, I finally got to see this on blu-ray after picking up a used copy a couple weeks back. I haven't read the particular story it adapted, so I am not sure how faithful the adaptation is except for comments here, but I have read a couple of the earlier volumes of the series and it felt like a Valerian and Laureline adventure to me. I thought the chemistry between the leads was a bit flat, but the film was still a fun sci-fi romp and enjoyed it quite a bit. The special features included were also quite interesting, mostly short documentaries on the origins of the strip, world buidling, effects and stunts, design etc.
-M
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Post by String on Sept 29, 2019 17:50:19 GMT -5
Finally, saw this film on SyFy the other night (not sure of actual run time of the film but they stretched it out to 3 hours with commercials. UGH)
Must say, enjoyed it very much. The visuals were simply stunning (wow, to have seen that on the big screen...) and the plot was rather straight-forward. The European sci-fi aesthetic (as with Fifth Element) was a fresh change of pace. My only quibble would be the romantic angle between Valerian and Laureline; it felt forced to some degree, like that should've been a character element introduced in a possible second or third film of this franchise instead.
I haven't read any of these comic volumes yet but checking on Comixology, they have the first five, six volumes available for free to download via Unlimited. Now, I can catch up on it since I'm intrigued to learn more about this series after this film.
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Post by Roquefort Raider on Sept 30, 2019 16:36:27 GMT -5
Come on, movie, get to Netflix already!!!
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Post by berkley on Sept 30, 2019 23:43:20 GMT -5
It's definitely worth watching. The things I disliked - mostly the way Valerian was written, cast, and performed and the romantic relationship between that character and Laureline - do take up far too much of the movie, so they can't really be ignored, but there are more than enough positives to make it both fun and interesting for any SF film fan, or even any film fan period, if only for the visuals.
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Post by Deleted on Oct 1, 2019 21:43:44 GMT -5
Come on, movie, get to Netflix already!!! I think it's on Prime, so I don't think Netflix will get it. -M I saw it on both blu-ray and DVD at Walmart in their $5 bins tonight if anyone is interested in owning a physical copy. -M
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Post by junkmonkey on Oct 26, 2019 5:45:46 GMT -5
If anyone is looking to buy the originals (in French) second-hand from eBay or wherever, try to avoid the 16/22 editions from Dargaud. They're a smaller format (160mm x 220mm) and the art has been cut up and rearranged so that one page of the original takes up two or three in the reprint. Sometimes panels are rotated, cropped, or flipped to make them fit.
That's why they're cheaper.
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Post by berkley on Oct 28, 2019 17:24:56 GMT -5
If anyone is looking to buy the originals (in French) second-hand from eBay or wherever, try to avoid the 16/22 editions from Dargaud. They're a smaller format (160mm x 220mm) and the art has been cut up and rearranged so that one page of the original takes up two or three in the reprint. Sometimes panels are rotated, cropped, or flipped to make them fit. That's why they're cheaper. The Intégral editions are pricey but worth it if you can afford them, with lost of nice extras - articles, interviews, etc.
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