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Post by Deleted on Apr 10, 2017 14:03:22 GMT -5
On a more serious note, I would love to see more cogent analysis of the comic market outside the US, but I never see any outside of the occasional article on a new Asterix and how it is selling or how European or Asian books fare in the American markets. If you have links to actual analysis of those markets and their impact on the comic industry as a whole, I would love to see them, as my google fu turns up bupkiss whenever I look. The only thing I find is British comic shop owners talking about American comics and their importance to their business model on shops who have features about them on Bleeding Cool. So help enlighten us if you have relevant info on the larger broader comic markets. -M The thing is, you're seeing British comic shop owners talking about American comics because 90% of what those shops sell are American comics. That's why the specialist shops exist. But the thing is, unlike America, the UK still has a high street comics industry, admittedly a fraction of the size it once was, but still there. And the comics sold in the newsagents and supermarkets, the UK originated comics, for the most part don't get sold in the comic shops-but then, they don't need to, since there are an awful lot more newsagents and supermarkets than there are comic shops. It's a completely different market. I could probably rustle up some figures for UK comics sales outside of the comic shops, but not all publishers submit sales figures for public scrutiny. Rebellion, who publish the 2000 AD stable of titles, don't for a start, and I suspect their sales are a lot higher than those of some of the companies that do. I'll see if I can dig up some figures for comparison. Cool, I would love to see what you can come up with of those numbers. I am genuinely curious. I have done a lot of due diligence on the American market over the years because I seriously considered investing/partnering in a friend's shop back east before I got married and moved out where I am now, and thought heavily about opening one here a while back, but eventually decided to pass in both instances because the numbers didn't work for me. I've worked in shops a few times over the years too, to get a sense of the business side of it, but since international shops had no bearing on what I was considering, I never gave them much attention, and I would be interested in closing some of that knowledge gap. -M |
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Post by tingramretro on Apr 10, 2017 14:04:44 GMT -5
A question for our Brit members or non-North American members...how viable would comic shops be in your area if they did not have American comic books (i.e. comics from American publishers and their intellectual property) available to sell? How much of their revenue stream is from American comics vs. comics from other areas? Is there enough other product available to keep a specialty shop viable selling comics only? -M No, there isn't. But then, as I said, the comic shops only really exist to sell US imports, and there are less than a hundred of them in the UK. But they are not the primary source of comics in the UK. You'll find several shelves of comics in most of the larger branches of WH Smith, for instance, and there are far, far more of them than there are comic shops. Most people in the UK are not really aware of the existence of comic shops, but everyone has a local newsagent who sells at least some comics. |
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Post by MDG on Apr 10, 2017 14:34:35 GMT -5
You can go to dozens of Facebook groups and and websites where crusty old guys trumpet that they are comic book fans, but haven't bought a book in decades.  |
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Post by brutalis on Apr 10, 2017 15:21:49 GMT -5
You can go to dozens of Facebook groups and and websites where crusty old guys trumpet that they are comic book fans, but haven't bought a book in decades. I say that we can wave bye bye to those crusty old guys and NOT consider them as fans. You aren't a fan if you aren't supportive! True fans speak with their wallet. True fans buy single back issues or trades or omni's. True fans support the old along with the new. Confessor is a fan of a big green intergalactic bounty hunting rabbit. Ish is a fan of pudding. Shaxper is a fan of Robin. Juggernaut is a fan of an unstoppable Juggernaut. All of us here support and encourage and engage (make it so #1) others through our fan support of the comic book medium with this community. Anybody can say they are a fan, but it ain't so unless you back up the talk. Just saying that you are a fan doesn't make it true... |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 10, 2017 15:38:10 GMT -5
I say that we can wave bye bye to those crusty old guys and NOT consider them as fans. You aren't a fan if you aren't supportive! True fans speak with their wallet. True fans buy single back issues or trades or omni's. True fans support the old along with the new. Confessor is a fan of a big green intergalactic bounty hunting rabbit. Ish is a fan of pudding. Shaxper is a fan of Robin. Juggernaut is a fan of an unstoppable Juggernaut. All of us here support and encourage and engage (make it so #1) others through our fan support of the comic book medium with this community. Anybody can say they are a fan, but it ain't so unless you back up the talk. Just saying that you are a fan doesn't make it true... As I have said many times many places-there is no right (or wrong) way to be a fan. Don't confuse customer with fan. Not all customers are fans and not all fans are customers. In your definition, someone without disposable income to spend on a hobby can't be a fan, which cuts out all sorts of people who might otherwise be fans of a property, book or character. Fans is not something elite. It's not an exclusive hobby, it's not I can be a better fan than you, it should be a community of people with a shared interest no matter how much or how little means they have to "support" what they like. The simple idea of "true fan" is a concept I vehemently disagree with. Gatekeeping has no place in comics. Gatekeeping and the idea of true fans is why the economics of comics are so shitty right now. They were keeping people out when they should have been trying to get people in. -M |
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Post by MDG on Apr 10, 2017 15:48:45 GMT -5
I say that we can wave bye bye to those crusty old guys and NOT consider them as fans. You aren't a fan if you aren't supportive! True fans speak with their wallet. True fans buy single back issues or trades or omni's. True fans support the old along with the new.... Anybody can say they are a fan, but it ain't so unless you back up the talk. Just saying that you are a fan doesn't make it true... Well, I did just buy Clowes Patience and Glanzman's USS Stevens stories. And I tend to buy everything by Kim Deitch and most of Los Bros work. And I'll drop cash at a comic show, often on TPBs of DC reprints or reader copies. But I have no desire to trek to the comic shop every week to drop cash on Marvel and DC floppies. There's nothing wrong with that, but it's a different market than the one I'm in. |
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Post by brutalis on Apr 10, 2017 16:50:53 GMT -5
I do agree mrp that there are many ways of being a fan. I truly understand there are those fans who can't afford comic books and elitism or gate-keeping or blaming or shaming wasn't my intent. I was more or less responding to the idea that it's easy to say you are a fan of something without showing support of it. Fans come in all forms and it is the fans who help everything thrive; whether it is the comic books, toys, movies, books, sports, music or anything else. You can show support and love for something without it being about money, but SHOWING SUPPORT is what is important. Fans can and should talk and spread the word about what they are a fan of. Guess i initially expressed myself poorly and for that I am sorry and apologize.
And yet without monetary support those things we love will wither or go away. Casual fans won't stop a sports team from moving away if ticket sales aren't there. Newspapers are obsolete and are almost gone with the advent of internet and television news providing faster free reporting. Record companies drop musicians for poor sales. Monthly magazines and comic books which were once a very affordable if not cheap entertainment for the poor or financially challenged have become expensive and cost prohibitive for many. Books and movies have become all about the best seller that is making big money with their initial release.
I enjoy the diversion and entertainment comic books supply me with each new story and the old issues continue to provide me joy and pleasure with every re-reading. So i support my own fan favorites with purchasing when i can and as i can afford doing so. I may go months without a weekly purchase as life and family and bills and emergencies demand. I save for those comic books or trades until i can afford the ones i want. I begin saving spare dollars in the summer so i can go to the local Comic-con the next year. For free I visit the CCF and interact and communicate daily during my work week. I talk about comic books, movies, books, sports, music and such with friends and workers and anyone who shows an interest. I provide comic books i have read to the pediatrics department her for children (those that are appropriate) and give my used or read comics and books and movies to the local library or charities that can utilize them for sales to help the the homeless and needful. These things i do in being a fan hoping to promote and encouraging others for new exposure to things which i am a fan of. This is what i meant by saying there is more that we should do than just stating you are a fan.
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Post by pinkfloydsound17 on Apr 10, 2017 21:21:22 GMT -5
I am a comic book fan...I'm still left...
Comics are available in many ways. Are there comic character fans? Heck yes. Are there comic fans in the sense that they read? Heck yes. Are there many that collect books and floppies? I feel those are waning. Then again, someone has to account for the many people who shell out hundreds for Walking Dead books or key issues. I have no idea how new sales are doing but I feel back issues are doing quite well.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 10, 2017 22:30:56 GMT -5
And yet without monetary support those things we love will wither or go away. Financially supporting shitty comics out of habit or alleged loyalty only enables and financially incentivizes more shitty comics, and those should wither and die. I support the creators and comics I think deserve supporting, but I feel no obligation to give my money to a company for products I don't like or don't think are quality just so they can survive. Survival of the fittest. Adapt or die. Make better comics and I will support you. Push out more of what I think are shitty comics and you won't see one red cent from me, and I won't miss you when you are gone. If I never buy another comic, I have enough reading material to last me the rest of my life. Give me a better reason to support your comics than a brand or a trade dress on assembly line pap comics and I will gladly give you my money for it in some format, but I am not going to buy what I consider bad comics for any reason. -M |
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Post by tingramretro on Apr 11, 2017 3:26:24 GMT -5
I found a piece on UK comic sales last year, specifically sales for the period January-June. Unfortunately, as the article notes, most of te more notable titles for older readers (like Commando, Viz, the Titan titles, The Phoenix and the 2000 AD stable) are not listed as the data has not been made available. Likewise The Beano. Consequently, most (though not all) of those listed are titles for younger children. And please remember that not all of these are monthly, several are weekly or fortnightly. Oh, and none of them are sold in the majority of comics shops. Here's a sampling of the titles listed. Toxic 58, 012 Doctor Who Magazine 25, 832 Doctor Who Adventures 11, 268 Disney Frozen 84, 021 Disney Star Wars Lego 80, 012 Lego Ninjago 77, 879 Peppa Pig 72, 973 Fun to Learn Peppa Pig 71, 978 CBeebies Magazine 58, 353 CBeebies Special 55, 373 CBeebies Art 61, 196 Sparkle World 56, 285 Lego Nexo Knights 51, 005 Star Wars Adventures 38, 014 Skylanders Universe 13, 686 Horrible Histories 23, 015 And here's the link, assuming it works for those not in the UK. downthetubes.net/?p=33120 |
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bor
Full Member
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Post by bor on Apr 11, 2017 4:22:18 GMT -5
A question for our Brit members or non-North American members...how viable would comic shops be in your area if they did not have American comic books (i.e. comics from American publishers and their intellectual property) available to sell? How much of their revenue stream is from American comics vs. comics from other areas? Is there enough other product available to keep a specialty shop viable selling comics only? -M I only have one real comic shop in my city. It would be viable, but it would be smaller without American comics. European albums and stuff like that is a large part of what he sells, but there is no doubt the American stuff is a vital part to. |
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Post by Deleted on Apr 11, 2017 8:36:51 GMT -5
In our county of 500,000 we have 4 LCS.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 11, 2017 10:38:39 GMT -5
I remember 20-22 years ago seemingly everyone thought comics were on the verge of fading away.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 11, 2017 10:55:34 GMT -5
In our county of 500,000 we have 4 LCS. In my area/hometown there is only one and I don't go there because it's also a front for drug use as well and I go to a LCS that's a good 40 minutes drive and I don't go there that much. There isn't many of them left these days. So sad to read your post Michael. |
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Post by antoine on Apr 11, 2017 12:42:19 GMT -5
A question for our Brit members or non-North American members...how viable would comic shops be in your area if they did not have American comic books (i.e. comics from American publishers and their intellectual property) available to sell? How much of their revenue stream is from American comics vs. comics from other areas? Is there enough other product available to keep a specialty shop viable selling comics only? -M No, there isn't. But then, as I said, the comic shops only really exist to sell US imports, and there are less than a hundred of them in the UK. But they are not the primary source of comics in the UK. You'll find several shelves of comics in most of the larger branches of WH Smith, for instance, and there are far, far more of them than there are comic shops. Most people in the UK are not really aware of the existence of comic shops, but everyone has a local newsagent who sells at least some comics. In France and Belgium, there is definitely shops who exclusively (or at least 90-95%... there's always a few translated comics) sell Bandes Dessinées. There is more than 5000 new products per year there. I would say Japan also has shop without American Comics, and only manga. |
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