Confessor
CCF Mod Squad
Not Bucky O'Hare!
Posts: 10,222
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Post by Confessor on Apr 10, 2020 10:07:23 GMT -5
Alex Ross had 90s work that actually became framed art and captured attention beyond comic book fans. No he didn't. It's only ever been comic fans who know of Alex Ross, by and large. Let's not kid ourselves. He's not famous in any way outside of the world of comic books or comic-related artwork. This is not some renowned artist who sells portraits or landscape paintings to the masses. This is a guy who draws musclebound men and women in long johns good.
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Post by tarkintino on Apr 10, 2020 10:17:35 GMT -5
Alex Ross had 90s work that actually became framed art and captured attention beyond comic book fans. No he didn't. It's only ever been comic fans who know of Alex Ross, by and large. ...and what are you basing that opinion on, because I lived through that period and know the opposite to be true.
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Post by berkley on Apr 10, 2020 11:55:26 GMT -5
Alex Ross had 90s work that actually became framed art and captured attention beyond comic book fans. No he didn't. It's only ever been comic fans who know of Alex Ross, by and large. Let's not kid ourselves. He's not famous in any way outside of the world of comic books or comic-related artwork. This is not some renowned artist who sells portraits or landscape paintings to the masses. This is a guy who draws musclebound men and women in long johns good. I agree with you - I doubt most people would recognise even Frank Frazetta if they weren't already a certain kind of fantasy-fan, let alone Alex Ross.
But I can imagine it's possible Ross might have attracted some people who normally wouldn't have done so to pick up a superhero comic - even though I think his work is laughably self-important, myself. No offence to fans, I know there's a lot of superhero readers who love his painted covers. Many of those non-fans might still not know his name or who he is, mind you, even after they looked at the comic.
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Post by rberman on Apr 10, 2020 12:15:31 GMT -5
If you asked a man on the street to name an artist, most people would just draw a blank. "Dr. Seuss" would probably be the top vote. So "nobody outside of comicdom has heard of him" isn't a helpful metric since it applies to pretty much everyone from Kirby and Eisner to today's stalwarts.
Rather than "do I know that name?" a more helpful metric would be how people respond to the art. Non-comics readers generally respond quite positively to Alex Ross art in my experience.
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Post by tartanphantom on Apr 10, 2020 12:25:50 GMT -5
A mullet on Superman was just wrong. A mullet on anyone is just wrong! There are some who would disagree with that.
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Post by chadwilliam on Apr 10, 2020 12:52:44 GMT -5
If you asked a man on the street to name an artist, most people would just draw a blank. "Dr. Seuss" would probably be the top vote. So "nobody outside of comicdom has heard of him" isn't a helpful metric since it applies to pretty much everyone from Kirby and Eisner to today's stalwarts. Rather than "do I know that name?" a more helpful metric would be how people respond to the art. Non-comics readers generally respond quite positively to Alex Ross art in my experience. Actually, I think the average man or woman on the street would say "Stan Lee". "Who's your favorite Batman artist?" "ummm… Stan Lee?" Still, I agree with you completely. I love Ross' work on Marvels and I recently bought a Yellow Submarine lunchbox adorned with his art which I normally wouldn't do since I generally only buy older Beatles memorabilia, but I couldn't pass up on this because of how beautiful it looked. And this is from someone who isn't crazy about most of Ross' superhero work (all too often, it looks like photographs of meat and potato cosplayers in spandex - seams on the costume and all), but he has some truly breathtaking work to be proud of as well. And I say that as someone who is probably a little more territorial about my likes and dislikes than I should be - to the average person on the street who knows these characters but couldn't care less about the comics, I can't imagine someone not being impressed enough to see something like Kingdom Come (a series I dislike) to stop and take it in. Though the 90's embraced the idea of using one bland, generic, posed cover after another, the period did have some pretty good to excellent artists: Mike Allred, Gene Ha, Norm Breyfogle, Matt Wagner, Simon Bisley, Kelly Jones, Dan Jurgens, Tom Grummett, Bruce Timm (arguably cheating on my part since he started with the Batman Animated Series, but his work did carry over to the comics), Andy Kubert, Stan Lee, Brent Anderson to name a dozen and that doesn't include artists such as Brian Bolland, Todd McFarlane, Steve Rude, Alan Davis, Mike Mignola, and so on who some might argue were more 80's artists than 90's despite their presence in the latter decade.
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Post by chadwilliam on Apr 10, 2020 13:10:38 GMT -5
A mullet on anyone is just wrong! There are some who would disagree with that.
You have a very beautiful wife and son, tartan.
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Post by MDG on Apr 10, 2020 13:23:54 GMT -5
Actually, I think the average man or woman on the street would say "Stan Lee". "Who's your favorite Batman artist?" "ummm… Stan Lee?" I always thought it ironic that for a long time the best-known "comic book artists" to non-comics fans were probably Stan Lee and Bob Kane.
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Post by Deleted on Apr 10, 2020 14:24:40 GMT -5
Well Alex Ross did get his art hung on buildings in New York and San Diego for all the general public to see, not just comics fans... both for SDCC and NYCC promotions in those cities, but also for the Marvelocity museum exhibit, which was a huge financial success and the Museums press releases indicated that the majority of visitors did not self-describe as comic book readers, which got him guest spots on late night talk shows... and a spotlight feature on the CBS Morning News... so I would venture to say his art has reached beyond just traditional comic books fans even if he is not a household name. -M
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Post by impulse on Apr 10, 2020 14:40:25 GMT -5
I've always liked his work when he stays in the somewhat retro uber-realistic style. He is unique at that. When he has branched out into more traditional or modern aesthetics I've found him rather unremarkable, though those are pretty few and far between.
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Confessor
CCF Mod Squad
Not Bucky O'Hare!
Posts: 10,222
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Post by Confessor on Apr 10, 2020 14:48:00 GMT -5
No he didn't. It's only ever been comic fans who know of Alex Ross, by and large. ...and what are you basing that opinion on, because I lived through that period and know the opposite to be true. What? You mean you lived through those far off, barely remembered days of the 1990s? Lol...yeah, so did everybody in this forum! What you're saying is ridiculous. Clearly, anyone who has ever bought an Alex Ross art print was a fan of comics or comic-related characters. Not least because THAT'S ALL HE DRAWS! But if I'm so wrong, you go on and find me some reliable third-party proof that supports your suggestion that framed prints of Ross's art were a big seller among the general, non-nerd population in the 1990s. I'll wait.
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Confessor
CCF Mod Squad
Not Bucky O'Hare!
Posts: 10,222
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Post by Confessor on Apr 10, 2020 15:01:46 GMT -5
Well Alex Ross did get his art hung on buildings in New York and San Diego for all the general public to see, not just comics fans... so I would venture to say his art has reached beyond just traditional comic books fans even if he is not a household name. Well, clearly if you have Ross's art on a huge public billboard then it's going to be seen by millions of people and most of them will not be comic fans. Likewise, with the odd TV spot that has covered him, millions may have tuned in on that particular day, but that's not enough to lodge him in the general public's consciousness. People have short memories. I'd also say that the vast majority of people visiting a Marvel Comics exhibition at a museum, where Ross's art happens to be displayed, are probably there because they like movies. But regardless, there's no way that the majority of visitors to the museum were particularly interested in who Alex Ross is. But that's all kind of beside the point because the disagreement is not about whether or not regular people have seen Ross's work, or even if he's a household name; it's about tarkintino's suggestion that in the '90s his art was so popular that framed prints of his work were selling in large numbers to people who were not fans of comics or comic characters. I say that's nonsense.
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Confessor
CCF Mod Squad
Not Bucky O'Hare!
Posts: 10,222
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Post by Confessor on Apr 10, 2020 15:05:55 GMT -5
For the record, I love Alex Ross's art. I just don't believe it's made any discernible impact outside of superhero fandom.
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Post by tartanphantom on Apr 10, 2020 16:24:21 GMT -5
There are some who would disagree with that.
You have a very beautiful wife and son, tartan. Do you have any idea how long it took me to get my collar to stand up like that?
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Post by tarkintino on Apr 10, 2020 16:30:41 GMT -5
Well Alex Ross did get his art hung on buildings in New York and San Diego for all the general public to see, not just comics fans... both for SDCC and NYCC promotions in those cities, but also for the Marvelocity museum exhibit, which was a huge financial success and the Museums press releases indicated that the majority of visitors did not self-describe as comic book readers, which got him guest spots on late night talk shows... and a spotlight feature on the CBS Morning News... so I would venture to say his art has reached beyond just traditional comic books fans even if he is not a household name. -M Well put, and his recognition did not begin in recent years; Marvels and Kingdom Come were among the biggest splashes of 1990s comics, but his work leaped beyond "standard comic art" which is why his work was sold as art to be framed, and yes, his work was appreciated/known beyond comic readers.
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