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Post by Icctrombone on Jun 14, 2024 17:27:33 GMT -5
Is it wrong to start drooling when a Barry Smith page I've never seen shows up? It's kind of Pavlovian. Those pages are from Avengers 99. It’s inked by Tom Sutton. The 3 parter from 98-100 has about 4 different inkers on his pencils, they were Joe Sinnott, Sal Buscema and Syd Shores and Sutton. |
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Post by Roquefort Raider on Jun 14, 2024 19:14:10 GMT -5
You gentlemen talked me into it. I found a used copy of Essential Avengers #5 online.
Incidentally, it also seems to have the Avengers-Defenders war, of which I only had a few issues!
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Post by Hoosier X on Jun 14, 2024 19:34:42 GMT -5
You gentlemen talked me into it. I found a used copy of Essential Avengers #5 online. Incidentally, it also seems to have the Avengers-Defenders war, of which I only had a few issues! The Avengers/Defenders War is kinda dumb but honestly it doesn’t matter because it’s also AWESOME!! Your opinion may vary based on how much of it you read when you were a teenager. I had two of the Avengers issues and a friend of mine had Defenders #10 with the Thor-Hulk fight. It was 1976 or 1977 and they were just a few years old. I wasn’t able to read the whole thing until decades later. |
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Post by Icctrombone on Jun 14, 2024 19:48:44 GMT -5
You gentlemen talked me into it. I found a used copy of Essential Avengers #5 online. Incidentally, it also seems to have the Avengers-Defenders war, of which I only had a few issues! The Avengers/Defenders War is kinda dumb but honestly it doesn’t matter because it’s also AWESOME!! Your opinion may vary based on how much of it you read when you were a teenager. I had two of the Avengers issues and a friend of mine had Defenders #10 with the Thor-Hulk fight. It was 1976 or 1977 and they were just a few years old. I wasn’t able to read the whole thing until decades later. You missed out. I bought them all as they came out and you like to call too many comics dumb. THEY ARE ALL GREAT, GREAT I TELL YOU !!!!!! |
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Post by foxley on Jun 14, 2024 20:23:56 GMT -5
He was not known for his women and they were not his strong point like Romita or Mooney. But foxley says "typical ugly Kirby artwork". Sorry, Kirby's art was never ugly.
Should also be noted that Kirby often did less than full pencils for Tales of Asgard and Vinnie finished them.
I have never made secret of the fact that Kirby's artwork does nothing for me, and I consider much of it to be ugly (including the panel I was specifically invited to comment on, otherwise this is not a thread you would normally find me in) . At its best, I find his art decent, but nothing to write home about. And I have never understood the fanaticism he inspires or why so many fans refuse to tolerate any criticism of him.
And "Kirby's art was never ugly"? So this is a thing of beauty in your eyes?
Sorry, but sometimes the emperor (or even the King) has no clothes.
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Post by kirby101 on Jun 14, 2024 20:39:42 GMT -5
Kirby haters love bringing out Captain Victory. Which still had some awesome art even at his advanced age. But that cover seem to prove Kirby was an awful artist. Guess what? The arm was a paste up. And that seems to be the only thing on the cover to prove Kirby's art was awful.  |
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Post by kirby101 on Jun 14, 2024 20:44:36 GMT -5
You gentlemen talked me into it. I found a used copy of Essential Avengers #5 online. Incidentally, it also seems to have the Avengers-Defenders war, of which I only had a few issues! The Avengers from that period was pretty good, and the A/D war was absolutely dumb fun. |
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Post by foxley on Jun 14, 2024 20:52:32 GMT -5
Kirby haters love bringing out Captain Victory. Which still had some awesome art even at his advanced age. But that cover seem to prove Kirby was an awful artist. Guess what? The arm was a paste up. And that seems to be the only thing on the cover to prove Kirby's art was awful. I have no intention of derailing this thread by continuing this argument, because nothing is going to change your mind. As I've already said, this is not a thread I usually peruse. I was asked for my opinion and provided it. Having a different opinion to yours does not make me "nuts" as you accused me of being (because I can assure you I was not being sarcastic). |
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Post by berkley on Jun 14, 2024 22:10:28 GMT -5
... Look at those thick thighs. ... This is a bad thing? |
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Post by berkley on Jun 14, 2024 22:21:51 GMT -5
Seriously, foxley has every right to dislike Kirby's style but I think these "Emperor has no clothes" sort of comments are out of line. As for the "deformed feet", etc, to me it's pretty clear the style he was using in superhero comics was never meant to be realistic, starting most obviously with the male characters and their impossibly wide-legged stances, etc, etc, all meant to convey an impression of power, energy, and dynamism; as the female character here in Thor (forget her name) was meant to suggest an impression of feminine curves without being photo-realistic. Anyone can do an image search for Kirby's romance comics if they want to see him drawing feet (for example) in a less sketchy fashion - although, having gone through this before many times, I'm sure it'll make no difference to anyone's opinion.
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Post by berkley on Jun 14, 2024 22:23:53 GMT -5
I would not curtail my general criticism of how Colletta inked Kirby, especially on those sparse and under rendered backgrounds. (and of course the erasing). But the way he inked the muscled figures gave them a chiseled power that was wonderful. This issues splash, the cover of the next issue and especially the splash page of the one after that are prime examples. Splash of #127 might be my favorite.
Yes, Thor has never looked as powerful with any the artist as he does with Kirby and Colletta. Mangog too has never looked as scary with any other art team.
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Post by berkley on Jun 14, 2024 22:30:07 GMT -5
Is it wrong to start drooling when a Barry Smith page I've never seen shows up? It's kind of Pavlovian. Avengers 98-100. Barry Smith goodness on a story largely plotted by him. The first page of issue #98 tells you what you have in store. And this came right after the last Kree Skrull War. You need to read them! I read #99 new from the stands when I was a kid but wasn't able to read #98 or #100 until decades later when I bought the back-issues online. The work BWS did for this story makes him one of my all-time favourite Avengers artists. In retrospect, I'm a little surprised that it fits the Avengers so well, as his style was already transitioning away from the Kirby-influenced superhero look towards the more classic fantasy style he'd use on Conan and in his later independent work. But it does. |
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Post by Hoosier X on Jun 14, 2024 22:44:24 GMT -5
I have no intention of derailing this thread by continuing this argument … That’s good to hear. I was starting to wonder. |
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Post by kirby101 on Jun 15, 2024 9:20:02 GMT -5
Back to that issue. So now Hercules has the hots for Jane. She is some woman, gets not one, but two gods to be into her. Next issues they come to blows over her. foxley might not like Kirby's women, but the Gods do! (a joke)
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Post by Roquefort Raider on Jun 15, 2024 10:28:22 GMT -5
Back to that issue. So now Hercules has the hots for Jane. She is some woman, gets not one, but two gods to be into her. Next issues they come to blows over her. foxley might not like Kirby's women, but the Gods do! (a joke)
Never underestimate the power of Chanel No 5!
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