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Post by Dr. Poison on Mar 16, 2015 13:47:40 GMT -5
I know many have stopped reading DC Comics recently due to the New 52. Many feel that the new costumes, origins, and directions just aren't to their liking. I have to admit that I like at least 50% of the New with some notable exceptions(Azzarello's Wonder Woman, Lobdell's Teen Titans, & Cyborg being on the JL). If you feel that strong about the New 52 that you quit reading DC Comics all together, Convergence is your chance to put your money where your mouth is and tell DC you are still willing to pay for comics that focus on the more classic interpretations of their characters. Converence mini-series will offer fans from all eras of DC Comics the opportunity to buy and read stories featuring their beloved characters from yester-year and you can be sure that if sales of these comics are high enough, DC will definitely make them an ongoing thing, especially if sales of some of these comics equal or surpass their New 52 counterparts. Convergence starts up in April.
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Post by fanboystranger on Mar 16, 2015 13:57:13 GMT -5
Some of the books seem interesting (like Peyer/Yeowell's Atom, Tim Truman and Jeff Parker's Hawkman, Parker/Shaner Shazam, Len Wein and Kelley Jones on Swamp Thing, and Simon Oliver's Plastic Man), but a lot of these books sound like inventory stories that have been shoehorned into this event. I'm more interested in a lot of the moves that DC is making for books after Convergence-- Yang on Superman, Sonny Liew on Dr Fate, Ennis and McCrea's Section Eight, Prez, Martian Manhunter, etc. DC's been talking that each book is going to be allowed to develop on its own, and that's great news to me. Pretty happy with their recent hires of Jamie Rich and Ben Abernathy, too. I think things are going to start moving forward at DC after the last half decade or so of the universe being more important than the books that comprise it.
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Post by coke & comics on Mar 16, 2015 14:08:50 GMT -5
A few of those definitely seem worth checking out.
In trade, of course.
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Post by DE Sinclair on Mar 16, 2015 14:16:00 GMT -5
I haven't heard how they're going to do the trades, but I'm guessing they won't be doing individual trades for each one, because each of the series are only 2 issues long. The main series, Convergence, will be 8 issues I believe.
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Post by Reptisaurus! on Mar 16, 2015 14:27:52 GMT -5
Yang on Superman, Sonny Liew on Dr Fate, Ennis and McCrea's Section Eight, Huh. isn't that crazy? The other two at least piqued my curiosity as well. As a long time DC reader I'm used to reboots, soft and hard. There's just nothing quite good enough to be worth 3 bucks every month right now.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 16, 2015 15:21:20 GMT -5
It will be difficult to read this in trade as each weeks worth of books and tie ins will be collected as 1 trade so there will be 8 trades over all, and if you are only interested in 1 or two series you would have to buy the trade for each week it appeared to be able to read it. And while it throws back to older DC, it really is a series of chapters of a larger event story, so I am not sure how well they will read on their own. Like Fanboy Stranger said, there are a few that sound interesting, but if they can't be read on their own without reading the larger whole I am completely uninterested and pretty much unwilling to give DC a penny for this type of thing.
Post-convergence, where they will finally take the shackles of a house style and editorial driven content off of creators, there are a lot of things that look very interesting to me. However, coupled with a price increase(more titles moving to $3.99, newsstand copies going to $4.99), my desire not to buy more new floppies, and DC's ludicrous gap time in releasing trade collections (on average 6 months after arc wraps up unlike say Image where the trade comes out the month after the last issue collected), my willingness to buy into this is severely limited. I even looked into possibly subscribing via DC to find they don't offer subs directly except on the top tier books and the cost is higher per issue than buying them at a comic shop, so I applaud the editorial direction they are moving, but not their business practices that make it harder for people to sample these books. I will however, check out the 8 pages stories they are going to make available after FCBD on their website and via Comixology, to see if anything grabs my fancy enough to go through the process of seeking out these books when they come out in trade sometime in 2016....(stories start in June, run on average 6 issues, plus 6 month gap, so June 2016 looks to be about the time these stories will be available to me, and well, I am not up for getting excited for things I won't see for another year when there is so much more to be excited about between now and then).
-M
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Post by earl on Mar 16, 2015 16:05:05 GMT -5
While good comics could be made with these characters, I think both Marvel and DC seemingly has run the well dry for super hero comics the past few years. I'm pretty much done with them and if I want super hero comics, I'd rather read the old ones. Only things I have been reading from DC and Marvel super hero lines is Multiversity and Starlin's Thanos vs. Hulk mini-series.
I have a handful of science fiction and crime comics on my pull list, but that's about it for new comics.
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Crimebuster
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Post by Crimebuster on Mar 16, 2015 16:42:33 GMT -5
I applaud your enthusiasm, Dr. Poison, but I'll take a pass on pretty much everything DC until they get a top-down turnover in personnel. Everything I have seen from them has just been grim, gritty and tedious, and their current house style of Jim Lee light makes my eyeballs bleed. I'm not a Marvel fan these days either, but they at least allow some fun and even innovative stuff to take place on the periphery, like Ms. Marvel and Squirrel Girl. DC just seems like one unending rut. They can change the costumes and temporarily bring back old favorites before inevitably savaging them again, but it's just putting lipstick on a pig to my eyes. Hope I'm wrong, but... yeah.
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shaxper
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Post by shaxper on Mar 16, 2015 17:11:26 GMT -5
I left because nothing mattered anymore. All major changes were done without artistic purpose as sales generators, everything ultimately got undone in favor of the status quo, and thus characters and titles never truly grew. This reversal on The Nu 52 only further emphasizes these problems. I want to invest in my characters and properties, not jump on for the latest thing until it's buried and forgotten four years later.
DC did some quality stuff during Nu 52 and, undoubtedly, will do so again, but they have no respect for the long view; only short term sales. I can't get behind that mentality.
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Post by fanboystranger on Mar 16, 2015 17:21:12 GMT -5
I applaud your enthusiasm, Dr. Poison, but I'll take a pass on pretty much everything DC until they get a top-down turnover in personnel. Everything I have seen from them has just been grim, gritty and tedious, and their current house style of Jim Lee light makes my eyeballs bleed. I'm not a Marvel fan these days either, but they at least allow some fun and even innovative stuff to take place on the periphery, like Ms. Marvel and Squirrel Girl. DC just seems like one unending rut. They can change the costumes and temporarily bring back old favorites before inevitably savaging them again, but it's just putting lipstick on a pig to my eyes. Hope I'm wrong, but... yeah. I'd say that DC has had the same kind of fun, innovative stuff on the perphery that Marvel has had over the past few years-- Dial H, Soule's Swamp Thing, GI Zombie, OMAC, I, Vampire, etc-- but it seems like so few people are willing to take a chance on it. Marvel can't seem to get these books to stick around longer than two years, either-- although I'm willing to bet on Ms Marvel making it-- but they do seem to raise some initial buzz around them.
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Post by Pharozonk on Mar 16, 2015 17:30:57 GMT -5
I left because nothing mattered anymore. All major changes were done without artistic purpose as sales generators, everything ultimately got undone in favor of the status quo, and thus characters and titles never truly grew. This reversal on The Nu 52 only further emphasizes these problems. I want to invest in my characters and properties, not jump on for the latest thing until it's buried and forgotten four years later. DC did some quality stuff during Nu 52 and, undoubtedly, will do so again, but they have no respect for the long view; only short term sales. I can't get behind that mentality. This is pretty much my mentality here too. Convergence just seems like DC's last attempt to drain a few dollars from pre-Nu52 fans who don't like their current line before kicking them off the cliff again. I've spent way too many years getting invested in the old universe to follow this new universe and know DC has no intention of going back to it again. I'm not crawling back to them anytime soon.
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Post by Reptisaurus! on Mar 16, 2015 17:39:20 GMT -5
I left because nothing mattered anymore. All major changes were done without artistic purpose as sales generators... At least they are following tradition! You could say the same thing in 1956, 1968, 1971, 1986, or the year 2000 and it would be equally true. I always feel that you're shocked that comic editors are putting money ahead of artistic merit, but that is what they always do and what they always have done, and that is their job.
Certainly it's fine to be annoyed at the nature of mainstream comics - obviously I'm still pissed at the 1986 Crisis attempts to switch out the cool Moorcookian science fiction of the Pre-Crisis DC Universe for waaangst based Claremontian post-crisis tearful dramatics - but you gotta keep in mind when reading mainstream comics that they are there to turn a profit. If the editors are thinking that anything is more important than generating sales, they are not doing their job and should probably be fired.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 16, 2015 17:45:58 GMT -5
I actually think DC has found a nice editorial balance post-Convergence-about half the line (25-30 titles) will maintain the tight universe continuity, general house style, and the rest of the line 20 or so books (including minis and ongoings) will be just tell stories you want to tell without the restraints of continuity or house styles shacking creators. I think it is a sign of the balance of power editorially shifting away from Didio, Harras and Johns to Mark Doyle and Diane Nelson-a chance for DC to be experimental and innovative again-something we haven't seen en masse at DC since the days of the so-called DC Reniassance under Jeanette Khan in the 80s. My problems moving forward aren't with DC's editorial policies, it's with the business practices mostly,the way they make books available, market them, pricing structures, trade collection policies, etc.
I'm interested enough in the potential of the stories and content to check out the post-convergence non-core stuff if it becomes available in our library system, but dislike the business practices enough that I do not want to give it my money in support of it. Not fond of Marvel's business policies much either, though they do have a better trade policy when it comes to getting the material out to the market quickly.
Of the post-Convergence stuff, I am most interested in checking out Liew on Dr. Fate, the new Omega Men series, and Yang's Superman. Of the precursors of this wave that appeared earlier-I am still interested in checking out Gotham by Midnight and Gotham Academy when DC gets around to putting trades out for them. I might check out Batgirl (I liked the first 2 issues before I stopped buying floppies altogether) and take a look at Black Canary, Martian Manhunter and Constantine (Riley Rossimo on art looks intriguing) and am curious what Mystik U and the other Dark book coming in July are. A lot may be influenced by those 8 page peeks DC is doing, but again it's going to take knock down wow my socks off content for me to support the business practices I dislike.
-M
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Post by crazyoldhermit on Mar 16, 2015 17:49:45 GMT -5
Convergence just seems like a bad case of blue balls. A smattering of issues showing old status quos won't change or alleviate anything done with the New 52. Even if it is nice to see those old versions again it doesn't lead to anything so whats the point? The real answer to DC's problem would have been to go all in and do a true reboot from scratch starting from the very beginning of Batman, Superman, Green Lantern, etc. Every reboot has been a half-measure, trying to mix in new stuff with old stuff to appease everybody. It has never worked, except for in the fifties when continuity was extremely loose to begin with and the audience cycled out every few years. But the realities of publishing prevented that from being practical, as starting with Batman's origin would mean you can't have Nightwing, Red Hood, Batgirl and Red Robin spinoffs. DC is too big a business to make such a radical change and this is why they're doomed to mediocrity. Same with Marvel. DC's ludicrous gap time in releasing trade collections (on average 6 months after arc wraps up unlike say Image where the trade comes out the month after the last issue collected) I'm pretty sure the reason for this is because of every single series launching stimutaneously. With the length of a trade being 5-7 issues DC had to stagger the releases or else there would just be two hotspots a year where the trades came out and the rest of the year would be blank. Frustrating but at least understandable on some level.
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Post by Ish Kabbible on Mar 16, 2015 19:22:56 GMT -5
After 50 years of buying comics, I'm done. They are essentially over-priced and I no longer want to accumulate pamphlets. I might check out a tradebook when it shows up at a library but comics compete with so many other things I devote my downtime to entertain me. The only thing comics used to have as an advantage was that it fulfilled my sense of nostalgia. But these DC/Marvel characters are nothing resembling what I used to enjoy. And any new concepts I am more than willing to wait till I can get it for free. I've spent enough money on comics in my lifetime. I deserve free books instead
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