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Post by Pharozonk on Nov 3, 2016 14:16:01 GMT -5
The thing is that third parties are faced with a catch-22 in American politics though. On one hand, they need to gain public awareness for local elections through national elections which are unfortunately the only elections most Americans pay attention to, let alone vote in. On the other hand, as you said, they can't get into power without winning local and state elections, which most people don't even turn up to vote at and Democrats and Republicans easily dominate in.
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Post by Warmonger on Nov 3, 2016 16:33:27 GMT -5
LOL
Can you imagine how badly Maddon would've been nailed to the wall if one of his many dumbass decisions last night would've cost the Cubs the series?
EDIT: Whoops, wrong thread.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 3, 2016 17:04:29 GMT -5
I know that you're politically very right-wing, which is perfectly fine and totally your choice, of course, and I also gather that you're also a big supporter of Trump. However, even as a supporter of his, you must surely concede that he is, at heart, a racist. I mean, there is ample evidence of this, what with his proposed ban on Muslims entering America, the notorious idea of building a Mexican border wall, his attack on the parents of that Muslim U.S. Army officer some months back, his failure to express disapproval over the white supremicist organisations that support him etc, etc. Does it not trouble you that you would be voting such a racist man into a position of power? A position from which he could make life really unpleasant for a lot of non-white people? I ask because an awful lot of grass root Republicans are uncomfortable with what Trump says, so I wonder if his supporters are too. I guess I'm asking if there's any hesitation underlying your intention to vote for him? A lot to respond here...I'll do it in bits. I don't consider his 'notorious' idea of building a Mexican border wall racist. There is a massive illegal-immigration and drug flow through that border. The current status quo is not working. The National Border Patrol Council is a union which represents about 16,500 border agents. It released this statement regarding Trump's wall. Is it because they hate Mexicans or because they are frustrated by what they experience on a daily basis? Play the race card if it suits your position. As for his attack on the Muslim U.S. Officer...what you did not bother to mention was that Khizr Khan started the unpleasantries by going on stage at the DNC National Convention and having an open house on Trump. Trump responded, and was widely panned for taking the bait instead of just shutting his mouth and letting the parent of a slain war hero vent.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 3, 2016 17:22:22 GMT -5
Had a dream last night that the election was finally over Then I woke up to a nightmare Was Hillary at Midtown Comics?
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Post by Ish Kabbible on Nov 3, 2016 17:38:40 GMT -5
Had a dream last night that the election was finally over Then I woke up to a nightmare Was Hillary at Midtown Comics? You have to walk up one flight of stairs to get to Midtown Comics. That's beyond her abilities
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Post by Deleted on Nov 3, 2016 17:40:30 GMT -5
Here's Confessor's racist Trump getting support from voters who aren't white.
(broken video link)
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Post by Pharozonk on Nov 3, 2016 18:11:57 GMT -5
Here's Confessor's racist Trump getting support from voters who aren't white. (broken video link)To be fair, all of those people are just justifying their vote using buzzwords from Trump's campaign speeches, buzzwords he's never backed up with solid policy plans of any kind too.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 3, 2016 18:17:36 GMT -5
To be fair, all of those people are just justifying their vote using buzzwords from Trump's campaign speeches, buzzwords he's never backed up with solid policy plans of any kind too. Exactly what is Hillary's policy for employment? She promised New Yorkers 200,000 jobs and it never happened. Instead, jobs were lost. Failed to deliver for her State of NY but will solve your country's employment problem. Congratulations.
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Post by Pharozonk on Nov 3, 2016 18:19:34 GMT -5
To be fair, all of those people are just justifying their vote using buzzwords from Trump's campaign speeches, buzzwords he's never backed up with solid policy plans of any kind too. Exactly what is Hillary's policy for employment? She promised New Yorkers 200,000 jobs and it never happened. Instead, jobs were lost. Failed to deliver for her State of NY but will solve your country's employment problem. Congratulations. My response has nothing to do with Hillary, who I'm not particularly fond of either. I'm just pointing out that those people in the video are just parroting Trump's empty catch phrases.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 3, 2016 18:44:05 GMT -5
Trump's businesses have declared bankruptcy six times, and his Toronto Hotel, which opened just four years ago, is in bankruptcy court this week. Congratulations. Nice try Sandman. Trump is not the project’s developer or even an investor; one of his partners, a Russian-born billionaire who got rich in Ukraine’s steel industry, controls the firm that’s in default.
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Confessor
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Post by Confessor on Nov 3, 2016 18:50:48 GMT -5
I know that you're politically very right-wing, which is perfectly fine and totally your choice, of course, and I also gather that you're also a big supporter of Trump. However, even as a supporter of his, you must surely concede that he is, at heart, a racist. I mean, there is ample evidence of this, what with his proposed ban on Muslims entering America, the notorious idea of building a Mexican border wall, his attack on the parents of that Muslim U.S. Army officer some months back, his failure to express disapproval over the white supremicist organisations that support him etc, etc. Does it not trouble you that you would be voting such a racist man into a position of power? A position from which he could make life really unpleasant for a lot of non-white people? I ask because an awful lot of grass root Republicans are uncomfortable with what Trump says, so I wonder if his supporters are too. I guess I'm asking if there's any hesitation underlying your intention to vote for him? I don't consider his 'notorious' idea of building a Mexican border wall racist. There is a massive illegal-immigration and drug flow through that border. The current status quo is not working. The National Border Patrol Council is a union which represents about 16,500 border agents. It released this statement regarding Trump's wall. Is it because they hate Mexicans or because they are frustrated by what they experience on a daily basis? Play the race card if it suits your position. Well, whether the current situation with illegal-immigration is working or not is really a side point. Trump's proposed wall along the Mexican border is an inherently racist idea because it's collectively noninclusive and assumes that all Mexican migrants are a threat to America and/or Americans. The truth of the matter is that Mexico is both an ally and a big trading partner to the U.S., while immigrating Mexicans actually contribute a lot of money to the American economy. If the purpose of the wall is to stem the flow of drugs and arms trafficking, it's the situation within America that needs addressing, since it's the U.S.'s hunger for drugs that fuel the cartels who smuggle that stuff in. Unfortunately, as history has taught us, the so-called "war on drugs" doesn't work. However, building a wall, at an astronomical cost -- billions of dollars, easily -- is not going to stop the flow of drugs and arms into America. I can't believe anyone could assume that the market forces of supply and demand could be thwarted so easily. I know that there is a very real problem with illegal immigration along the Mexican border, and I can fully understand why Americans are frustrated by that. I don't want illegal immigration into my own country either! However, it's the way that Donald Trump talks about these desperate people that marks him as a racist in my book. I had to Google for the following quote of Trump's, which I remembered reading back in the summer, but, on the subject of illegal immigration, he said this: " When Mexico sends its people, they're not sending their best ... They're bringing drugs. They're bringing crime. They're rapists. And some, I assume, are good people." My problem with this comment and why I deem it racist in the extreme, is the way in which Trump labels Mexican immigrants as substandard, drug-pushing, criminals and rapists ... then, almost as an afterthought, he adds, "some are good people." It's pretty clear to anyone, I would think, that this is a statement made by a man with a deep rooted prejudice against Mexicans. And this is someone who could end up being President of the United States! As for his attack on the Muslim U.S. Officer...what you did not bother to mention was that Khizr Khan started the unpleasantries by going on stage at the DNC National Convention and having an open house on Trump. Trump responded, and was widely panned for taking the bait instead of just shutting his mouth and letting the parent of a slain war hero vent. It was more Trump's assumption that Mr. Kahn's wife was being prevented from talking, due to Islam's patriarchal traditions, when, actually, she was just too upset and shocked to talk, that I objected to. Here's Confessor's racist Trump getting support from voters who aren't white. (broken video link)Right, so Trump's not a racist because there are African-Americans who will vote for him? Hmmmm....I don't see that as a logical conclusion at all. Here in the UK, there are plenty of 2nd or 3rd generation Muslims who vote for UKIP, but the party is still full of seemingly unabashedly racist a**hats. That's not how racism works, Jez. It's the old, "I'm not racist...see, I've got black friends" shtick. EDIT: You seem to be misinterpreting my earlier response to you as some kind of an attack. That's not how it was meant at all. I'm just curious as to whether there is any doubt about Trump's suitability to govern the U.S. in your mind or if you are 100% convinced that he's the right person for the job? Do you have any misgivings about him?
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Post by Warmonger on Nov 3, 2016 18:58:49 GMT -5
I don't see what's inherently racist about supporting a wall along the southern border.
You want to be a U.S. Citizen?
Great, grand, wonderful...then go through the proper channels to become a U.S. citizen.
The legal way. The just way. The right way.
But allowing hundreds of thousands of illegals every year to simply hop a fence and waltz in here, tax free?
Nah, that shits for the birds. Can't support it.
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Post by Confessor on Nov 3, 2016 19:09:03 GMT -5
I don't see what's inherently racist about supporting a wall along the southern border. You want to be a U.S. Citizen? Great, grand, wonderful...then go through the proper channels to become a U.S. citizen. The legal way. The just way. The right way. But allowing hundreds of thousands of illegals every year to simply hop a fence and waltz in here, tax free? Nah, that shits for the birds. Can't support it. Well, I think I've outlined why it's inherently racist in my above post. I don't know how to make it much plainer. However, you seem to have misunderstood me: I'm not condoning illegal immigration. I can be both against illegal immigration and still think that erecting a huge wall, stretching right across the Mexican border, is an inherently racist concept (not to mention economically unfeasible). The two aren't mutually exclusive, you know.
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Post by DE Sinclair on Nov 3, 2016 19:28:22 GMT -5
I don't see what's inherently racist about supporting a wall along the southern border. You want to be a U.S. Citizen? Great, grand, wonderful...then go through the proper channels to become a U.S. citizen. The legal way. The just way. The right way. But allowing hundreds of thousands of illegals every year to simply hop a fence and waltz in here, tax free? Nah, that shits for the birds. Can't support it. A guy who wants a wall to keep out a whole group of people because he thinks they're all rapists and drug smugglers? That's what's inherently racist about it.
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Post by Slam_Bradley on Nov 3, 2016 19:28:38 GMT -5
The thing is that third parties are faced with a catch-22 in American politics though. On one hand, they need to gain public awareness for local elections through national elections which are unfortunately the only elections most Americans pay attention to, let alone vote in. On the other hand, as you said, they can't get into power without winning local and state elections, which most people don't even turn up to vote at and Democrats and Republicans easily dominate in. The other issue with Third Parties is that the nature of the Electoral College promotes a two-party system. While people bitch about the Electoral College system, it is incredibly rare for there to be a difference between the popular vote winner and the Electoral College winner. And faithless Electors are also quite rare. However, a Third Party candidate who could win significant Electoral votes could throw the election to the House of Representatives, which would yield an even more undemocratic result than what we already get.
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