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Post by Roquefort Raider on Nov 9, 2016 8:55:42 GMT -5
The hard part for me is not Trump winning, in and of itself. I'm shocked and disappointed, but I could have dealt with that. What really throws me is that we gave the Republicans a full carte blanc mandate to keep doing what they are doing in the House and Senate. I thought the entire point of voting for Trump was to be anti-establishment, but the obstructionist establishment is back in force with renewed confidence, and forget any checks and balances on the president now. Yes, the point was to elect a candidate who was not corrupt, but the winner goes to court next month on fraud charges. The point was to elect a candidate who would not be part of the establishment, but the winner is a billionaire, part of the rich white man's club, one who doesn't pay taxes and is still rich after six bankruptcies. The point was to change the way things are done, but a blank check was given to the party that insists on nothing being done unless it suits its ideological agenda. Makes one take Churchill's comment on democracy to heart! WASP power!!! ( Straight WASP power, that is). Nah... I fully trust these results. We've had weeks of witnessing what the Trump electors were like. They wear t-shirts saying " Journalist. Tree. Rope. You do the maths" and everyone is fine with it. They shout that they want Clinton jailed and they mean it. They hear their candidate brag that he grabs women by the p***, and when he next says he respects women they believe him. With such material, no need for Russia to intervene: all it has to do is sit back and relax! Not rigged, no, but the elector system is a bit odd. It's the second time in recent memory that a grotesque candidate is elected without winning the popular vote.
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Post by Prince Hal on Nov 9, 2016 9:02:51 GMT -5
Oh it was rigged, just not in the way anyone is mentioning in print or on television.
Remember that this was the first election in 50 years that was run without the full protection of the Voting Rights Act.
Thank you, John Roberts.
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Post by Prince Hal on Nov 9, 2016 9:32:16 GMT -5
Oh, and to all those who are happy about this, you're not alone.
Creationists are happy.
Frakkers are happy.
The KKK is happy.
Breitbart is happy.
Anti-Semites are happy.
Citizens United is happy.
The Koch Brothers are happy.
Climate-change deniers are happy.
Jerry Falwell, Jr., Ralph Reed, the Le Pen family, and Nigel Farage are happy.
ISIS is happy.
Nativists and xenophobes are happy.
And of course, Putin is very happy.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 9, 2016 9:38:14 GMT -5
I think the worst thing about being a confirmed cynic, bordering in many respects on outright nihilism, is having one's biases corroborated. *sigh*
If one suspects that huge swaths of the populace of one's country (not to mention certain representatives of other countries ... hell, might as well just extend the description to humanity in general) are abject idiots & then sees numbers confirming that ... well, it's hard to take any satisfaction in being correct. Better, I'm sure, to maintain some sort of upbeat view, but unfortunately I somehow lost the ability to lie convincingly to myself way back in my teens.
Otherwise, I stopped following the election results on my phone about 8:30 last night & didn't see until right at 2 hours ago how things turned out. Needless to say, my thoughts are all aswirl right now; I'll have to nail them down into something within at least the outer boundaries of coherency as the day wears on.
I will say that with any luck, the Far Left can benefit from this ... though of course that was supposed to happen with a Nixon victory in '68 as well, & I don't really recall that occurring.
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Post by adamwarlock2099 on Nov 9, 2016 9:44:23 GMT -5
All that being said, if Trump can behave like a human being and work to meet the interests of both his party and his detractors, I will do my best to keep an open mind and give him a chance. I don't think this is Hitler's second coming. That's sheer hyperbole. I don't say much about politics, and I probably won't say much on the results, but this. And I do not mean to dissect and dismiss your other points shax, that's not my intention, it's just this is the only point I feel qualified to comment on. This is the only thing that doesn't have me worried that there is some impending doom on the US at this point. I don't think Trump is going to bring about any big threat to the US. Will the next four years be shit with his decisions/policies? That's to be seen. And fair to give him a chance to go either way. But I don't feel any certain fear over a WW3 or nuclear war than I would/have with any other president.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 9, 2016 9:49:50 GMT -5
CNN reported briefly some political violence is happening in California that I'm not quite clear on and can't make a good comment about it. They showed clips of fires, truck being damaged, and among other things. Over 20 people were arrested already ...
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Post by Warmonger on Nov 9, 2016 9:59:14 GMT -5
Pantsuit manufacturers taking a big hit this morning
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Post by Roquefort Raider on Nov 9, 2016 10:00:43 GMT -5
I think the worst thing about being a confirmed cynic, bordering in many respects on outright nihilism, is having one's biases corroborated. *sigh* If one suspects that huge swaths of the populace of one's country (not to mention certain representatives of other countries ... hell, might as well just extend the description to humanity in general) are abject idiots & then sees numbers confirming that ... well, it's hard to take any satisfaction in being correct. Remember Gene Wilder's wise words : "You've got to remember that these are just simple farmers. These are people of the land. The common clay of the new West. You know... ". It won't, I'm afraid. There is no real Left in the US; there's a moderate Right and a plain ol' Right with temptations of going farther right. The Democrats were punished for alleged faults attributable to a right-wing mindset (Wall Street first!) and were replaced by an ever worse proposition (Tax-dodging, regulation adverse billionaires). Bernie notwithstanding, socialism doesn't seem to have a lot of traction in the US. I'm sure that whatever problems beset the US in the coming years, they will be blamed on whatever isn't right-wing enough. Immigrants. Minimal wage. Obamacare. Medicare. Equality in the workplace. And because things will probably be dire in four years, voters will re-elect Trump or whoever takes his place if he doesn't want to run again. People forgot what happened the last time a know-nothing Republican led the country, and that was only eight years ago. If the great recession couldn't convince people that a right-wing government isn't the way of the future, I can't imagine any scenario in which the Left could make significant gains. If anything, when things eventually come to a boil, I expect the Right to be replaced by increased turmoil and chaos rather than by a Left-wing movement. The future won't be like Star Trek after all, it will be like Mad Max.
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Post by Prince Hal on Nov 9, 2016 10:01:33 GMT -5
Pantsuit manufacturers taking a big hit this morning Common sense and decency took a bigger one.
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Post by Warmonger on Nov 9, 2016 10:03:26 GMT -5
Pantsuit manufacturers taking a big hit this morning Common sense and decency took a bigger one. I know, I know We anti-Hillary folks are just the worst
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Post by Roquefort Raider on Nov 9, 2016 10:04:47 GMT -5
Pantsuit manufacturers taking a big hit this morning Common sense and decency took a bigger one. But, Prince Hal, think of the gains made by the p***y-grabbing, tax-dodging, disability-mocking, racist, xenophobic, hero-mocking demographic! That's got to count for something!
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Confessor
CCF Mod Squad
Not Bucky O'Hare!
Posts: 10,080
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Post by Confessor on Nov 9, 2016 10:07:23 GMT -5
Common sense and decency took a bigger one. But, Prince Hal, think of the gains made by the p***y-grabbing, tax-dodging, disability-mocking, racist, xenophobic, hero-mocking demographic! That's got to count for something! Not that everyone who voted for Trump is one of things (he said with his moderator's hat on).
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Post by Roquefort Raider on Nov 9, 2016 10:18:43 GMT -5
But, Prince Hal, think of the gains made by the p***y-grabbing, tax-dodging, disability-mocking, racist, xenophobic, hero-mocking demographic! That's got to count for something! Not that everyone who voted for Trump is one of things (he said with his moderator's hat on). True. But the elected candidate sure is.
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Post by The Captain on Nov 9, 2016 10:19:45 GMT -5
Common sense and decency took a bigger one. But, Prince Hal, think of the gains made by the p***y-grabbing, tax-dodging, disability-mocking, racist, xenophobic, hero-mocking demographic! That's got to count for something! And this is one of the reasons that Trump won. Because the progressive liberal side made this an election between "decent folks" (those who agree with them) and folks like those you described, without ever thinking those people might have reasons to vote, either for Trump or against Hillary, that didn't spawn from those people being "deplorables"
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Post by Nowhere Man on Nov 9, 2016 10:31:48 GMT -5
Another factor that few on the left like to talk about is how classical liberals have become disenfranchised by regressive liberalism. Many of these people (basically moderates who take a more nuanced view) either didn't vote or voted for Trump to spite Hillary and to stick it to a party and social order that has clearly lost its way.
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