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Post by Icctrombone on Jun 12, 2018 5:10:55 GMT -5
Here's a question- I read on CBR Erik Larsen say they get the same amount of money from Images best selling title as they get from their worst selling book. in other words, whether TWD sells 300K or 2K they get the same amount of money from those creators. What kind of fee do they get per book ? I imagine @mrp , might know. I don't know the amount, but Image gets a fee for publishing, not a share of the profits, so yes it is the same rate for every book, and how successful the book is doesn't affect Image's take. Now a book that doesn't achieve certain sales level may not be able to afford to keep paying the fee for each issue and trade, which could affect how long the book runs with Image, but it's not Image's decision to cancel a book because it doesn't do well or to keep publishing a successful book, that's the creator's decision. -M That's how he Erik Larsen explained it. I guess that means the lowest selling book and the highest pays Image the same money. That is a weird business model. But maybe the fee is per month and it's a large amount, After all, Image is in the business to make money.
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Post by rberman on Jun 12, 2018 6:39:23 GMT -5
I don't know the amount, but Image gets a fee for publishing, not a share of the profits, so yes it is the same rate for every book, and how successful the book is doesn't affect Image's take. Now a book that doesn't achieve certain sales level may not be able to afford to keep paying the fee for each issue and trade, which could affect how long the book runs with Image, but it's not Image's decision to cancel a book because it doesn't do well or to keep publishing a successful book, that's the creator's decision. -M That's how he Erik Larsen explained it. I guess that means the lowest selling book and the highest pays Image the same money. That is a weird business model. But maybe the fee is per month and it's a large amount, After all, Image is in the business to make money. Image is in business to make money for its owners. It sounds like a system where the money passes through the company to themselves as fluidly as possible. Not a bad way to go for creators who are already stars, but the is also no subsidy built in for developing new talent in such a system.
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Post by Icctrombone on Jun 12, 2018 8:07:10 GMT -5
These days you can get a fundme page to get your start if you have the talent and discipline.
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Post by rberman on Jun 12, 2018 8:27:59 GMT -5
These days you can get a fundme page to get your start if you have the talent and discipline. Crowdsourcing works well for established artists. I fund a lot of musical projects that way. But I pass by all the ones with whom I am not familiar, because I do not have time to cull through all the people who want my money to determine which ones are worthy, especially when They don’t have a track record on which to draw. This is a way that a spinner rack, for all its liabilities, is superior, since I can quickly assess the product before I buy it, rather than buying it first and then months later discovering what I have purchased. This was the value of publishers like Marvel and DC, fostering new talent both bad and good, so that time can sort the good from the bad instead of dumping both onto crowdsourcing, where they would be ignored.
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Confessor
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Post by Confessor on Jun 12, 2018 12:16:57 GMT -5
I did enjoy the Canto Bright field trip, though. The whole thing with the alien horses and the little kids being inspired was super hokey, but I thought it worked. Blimey! Talk about one man's meat and all that... That entire sequence was my least favourite part of an already dire movie. For me, the Canto Bright sequence -- with its abrupt change of mood, nonsensical plot, unnecessary animal rights subtext, and cloying (read nauseating) over sentimentality -- was the moment when the Last Jedi train left the tracks. I agree that's probably where people get annoyed... diversity to check a box is counter productive, IMO.. which is why I think she should have been a cool alien instead I agree with this, but, actually, if there simply hadn't been a Rose character -- human, alien or otherwise -- would it have mattered? It would've made zero difference to the film. She was entirely surplus to requirements.
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Post by Icctrombone on Jun 12, 2018 12:32:03 GMT -5
I did enjoy the Canto Bright field trip, though. The whole thing with the alien horses and the little kids being inspired was super hokey, but I thought it worked. Blimey! Talk about one man's meat and all that... That entire sequence was my least favourite part of an already dire movie. For me, the Canto Bright sequence -- with its abrupt change of mood, nonsensical plot, unnecessary animal rights subtext, and cloying (read nauseating) over sentimentality -- was the moment when the Last Jedi train left the tracks. I agree that's probably where people get annoyed... diversity to check a box is counter productive, IMO.. which is why I think she should have been a cool alien instead I agree with this, but, actually, if there simply hadn't been a Rose character -- human, alien or otherwise -- would it have mattered? It would've made zero difference to the film. She was entirely surplus to requirements. I didn't see TLJ so I thought maybe her character was another Jar Jar Binks.
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Confessor
CCF Mod Squad
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Post by Confessor on Jun 12, 2018 12:40:18 GMT -5
Blimey! Talk about one man's meat and all that... That entire sequence was my least favourite part of an already dire movie. For me, the Canto Bright sequence -- with its abrupt change of mood, nonsensical plot, unnecessary animal rights subtext, and cloying (read nauseating) over sentimentality -- was the moment when the Last Jedi train left the tracks. I agree with this, but, actually, if there simply hadn't been a Rose character -- human, alien or otherwise -- would it have mattered? It would've made zero difference to the film. She was entirely surplus to requirements. I didn't see TLJ so I thought maybe her character was another Jar Jar Binks. Oh no, nothing like that. Rose was nowhere near as important a character as Jar Jar Binks. I mean, Jar Jar might've been annoying, but at least he achieved something and moved the plot forward. In a nutshell, the idiot online trolls who hounded the actress off of social media were objecting to her ethnicity and a supposed "SJW" agenda in modern day Star Wars that she allegedly represents.
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Post by wildfire2099 on Jun 12, 2018 18:02:36 GMT -5
Blimey! Talk about one man's meat and all that... That entire sequence was my least favourite part of an already dire movie. For me, the Canto Bright sequence -- with its abrupt change of mood, nonsensical plot, unnecessary animal rights subtext, and cloying (read nauseating) over sentimentality -- was the moment when the Last Jedi train left the tracks. I agree it was a total shift in tone, but I'd agrue that it was far more interesting the the silly chase scene that went on far too long.... and that silly hyperspace thing? Yes, the plot made no sense, but neither did any of Poe's other plans.. .I choose to see that as pointing out his failings so (perhaps) he can develop and not suck in the future. I agree that's probably where people get annoyed... diversity to check a box is counter productive, IMO.. which is why I think she should have been a cool alien instead I agree with this, but, actually, if there simply hadn't been a Rose character -- human, alien or otherwise -- would it have mattered? It would've made zero difference to the film. She was entirely surplus to requirements.[/quote] Well, not NO purpose... Finn having a love interest that's no Rey is slightly less nauseating. Don't get me wrong, that whole half (1/3 maybe?) of the movie could have just been a short story in some book, or a comic mini, but it didn't bother me... if you want Finn to be the new Leia (or maybe he's the new Wedge? not totally sure at this point), he does have to actually be in the movie. As far as the diversity, thing, I was thinking about it, and I was going to post about how only humans have interspecies diversity, and maybe we should have lime green Rodians or Twi'leks with an extra Lekku or something, and then I saw Solo today and there we have an orange Rodian, so I stand corrected On another front, I HATE that every time there's any sort of diversity or political statement in anything people who don't like it cry... 'SJW' for conservatives and 'Racism' for Liberals... can we just understand that fiction is a great way to make a political statement, and accept those statements for what they are? No one is trying to 'co-op' or steal anything, sci fi has been making political statements since people came up with sci-fi.. it SHOULD be there.
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Post by Icctrombone on Jun 12, 2018 18:02:52 GMT -5
SJW, Hmmm. That reminds me of a joke ( I can say this joke because I'm Puerto Rican ) Why don't you see any Puerto Ricans in Star Trek ? They don't want to work in the future either.
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Post by spoon on Jun 12, 2018 19:47:50 GMT -5
That's how I've always read/known it to be too. Maybe we read the same interview where he said that. I don't remember Claremont stating any great favoritism for Nightcrawler though. I don't know who brought the Errol Flynn fan aspect to him. Obviously Phoenix and her 'song of power within her' thing was a Claremont favorite as rising from the ashes in some form or other became pretty much a party piece of so many X-Men books, so I would think Phoenix was his favorite. John Byrne seems the one who developed Wolverine the most once he came in, and then Kitty Pryde/Sprite. Nightcrawler was most definitely Cockrum's favorite character. He created the character for a Legion of Superheroes spinoff proposal, called The Outsiders, which also features a proto-Storm (mainly in the design). It didn't fly at DC and he brought the designs with him to Marvel, using Nightcrawler specifically and modifying the female character into Storm's design. A couple of other turned up in the Shi-ar Imperial Guard (a Legion pastiche, from the beginning). Cockrum added the Errol Flynn stuff, as that's how he drew Nightcrawler, when he used his image inducer to give himself a human-looking form, a gimmick which was eventually dropped, then briefly used when they went into the climax of the Shi'ar storyline (where we had the transition from Cockrum to Byrne). Cockrum was a big fan of swashbucklers and it factored into the design and character of Corsair and the Starjammers. Cockrum also did the Nightcrawler mini-series, in 1985-86, which featured Nightcrawler in piratical action, on the cover... Cockrum both wrote and drew that mini. Byrne is the one who kept Wolverine from being killed off (Claremont was tired of the character) and helped turn him into a fan favorite. Kitty was Byrne's creation, as she was based on a friend from art school, though much of her personality was drawn from Louise Simonson's daughter (with Jeff Jones), Julie. So, she was kind of a mix of Byrne, Claremont and Simonson's input. Phoenix was definitely a Claremont favorite and Storm became one later and, if you read across the series, you'll notice she becomes more like Phoenix. Yeah, I think Nightcrawler was a Cockrum favorite. I think the visual for Nightcrawler was pretty much unchanged from the proposed Legion character. But I do suspect Claremont had a significant influence on Kurt's personality based on the contrast between Len Wein's brief stint and what came after. Kurt's pretty dour and even angry the first couple issues before he gets more joie de vivre. Storm was actually a combo of two characters Cockrum was working to try to use in LOSH. IIRC, one was a female character called Black Cat (before the Spider-Man character existed) who looked a lot like Storm. The other was a weather-controlling male called Tempest or something like that. Storm melded characteristics of both. Supposedly, Colossus was originally envisioned as the star of the book and that's why he's prominent and often placed near the center of a lot of the early covers. Byrne has taken credit for Kitty's creation and lamented how he believes Claremont changed her from Byrne's original conception after he left the book. For one, Byrne didn't want Kitty to be a genius. He thought it took her away from being a regular, relatable kid.
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Post by rberman on Jun 12, 2018 19:58:19 GMT -5
Storm was actually a combo of two characters Cockrum was working to try to use in LOSH. IIRC, one was a female character called Black Cat (before the Spider-Man character existed) who looked a lot like Storm. The other was a weather-controlling male called Tempest or something like that. Storm melded characteristics of both. Supposedly, Colossus was originally envisioned as the star of the book and that's why he's prominent and often placed near the center of a lot of the early covers. Storm’s bikini-with-navel-ring also reminds me of the Saturn Girl redesign. Colossus had a striking appearance for covers but seemed pretty neglected on interiors as a character.
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Confessor
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Post by Confessor on Jun 12, 2018 22:31:01 GMT -5
As far as the diversity, thing, I was thinking about it, and I was going to post about how only humans have interspecies diversity, and maybe we should have lime green Rodians or Twi'leks with an extra Lekku or something, and then I saw Solo today and there we have an orange Rodian, so I stand corrected We had seen that kind of "alien diversity" in the original trilogy and prequel trilogy too. Right from their first appearance in ROTJ, we saw Twi'leks of different colour: Bib Fortuna was flesh coloured, while Jabba's dancing girl, Oola, was green (the ROTJ Special Edition also introduced a pale blue Twi'lek dancer with the Max Rebo Band). As for Rodians, I think the Clone Wars CGI cartoon was the first to show us different skin colours within that particular species.
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Post by codystarbuck on Jun 12, 2018 23:57:50 GMT -5
Storm was actually a combo of two characters Cockrum was working to try to use in LOSH. IIRC, one was a female character called Black Cat (before the Spider-Man character existed) who looked a lot like Storm. The other was a weather-controlling male called Tempest or something like that. Storm melded characteristics of both. Supposedly, Colossus was originally envisioned as the star of the book and that's why he's prominent and often placed near the center of a lot of the early covers. Storm’s bikini-with-navel-ring also reminds me of the Saturn Girl redesign. Colossus had a striking appearance for covers but seemed pretty neglected on interiors as a character. The Saturn Girl costume was also Cockrum's. He's the one who gave the Legion their 70s makeover (though Mike Grell tweaked a couple of them). You can find similar desgns in his work on Marvel's John Carter of Mars series, especially Dejah Thoris....
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Post by Farrar on Jun 13, 2018 1:22:41 GMT -5
The Saturn Girl costume was also Cockrum's. He's the one who gave the Legion their 70s makeover (though Mike Grell tweaked a couple of them) That Saturn Girl costume was designed/created by a fan named K. Haven Metzger ("K" is for Kim, and he's a guy btw); here it is along with some other fan fashion submissions that appeared in the giant issue Adventure Comics #403 (cover dated Mar-Apr. 1971) And here are the other pages in that feature: Metzger's new SG costume actually was used in a story prior to the above feature, in the LSH story in Action #392 cover-dated Sept. 1970. In various places such as the Legion Outpost (back then) and in online venues, Metzger has written that he was very surprised when he opened this Action issue, as he'd forgotten all about his design. So here it is, from 1970's Action #392, art by Mortimer/Abel:
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Post by rberman on Jun 13, 2018 6:35:31 GMT -5
They sure wanted to see some skin on the female costumes. The double standard is clear when you see that dude in the Saturn Girl outfit above.
Several of those became canon: Duo Damsel, Shadow Lass, Light Lass, and Karate Kid (But in tan, not white, because colors bleed through white from the other side of the page). I love that Shinking Violet outfit. She looks ready to take a bus to a “No Nukes” rally.
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