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Post by Deleted on Sept 4, 2015 14:36:56 GMT -5
Yeah, that would work for me. I thought of mentioning Wally Wood in Shock Suspenstories
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Post by Calamas on Sept 5, 2015 10:10:36 GMT -5
I’m not sure of what defines a run for my own benefit let alone for anything as broad as a community. For Jonny Quest the closest William Messner-Loebs had to a regular penciller was Marc Hempel. I don’t feel comfortable including the run. Similarly on Silver Surfer Steve Englehart had a rotation of Marshall Rogers, Joe Staton and Ron Lim (until he finally took over). I’m not sure I can count that either. So, with admitted ambiguity and no question that I’m forgetting a run or two somewhere, my current best guess:
Blackhawks by Mark Evanier/Dan Spiegle
Fantastic Four by John Byrne
Grimjack by John Ostrander/Tim Truman
Iron Man by David Michelinie/John Romita, Jr./Bob Layton
Jon Sable by Mike Grell
The Question by Denny O'Neil/ Denys Cowan
The Shadow Strikes by Gerard Jones/Eduardo Barreto
Spectre by John Ostrander and Tom Mandrake
Starman by James Robinson/Tony Harris
Swamp Thing by Alan Moore/ Stephen Bissette
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Post by kongat44 on Sept 6, 2015 22:29:26 GMT -5
Keeping in mind that this could easily change depending on the day you ask me and the mood I'm in: 2. The Amazing Spider-Man #1-28 and Annuals #1-2 (Lee/Ditko) Cei-U! I summon the faves! I have to think you meant The Amazing Spider-Man #1-38, and Annuals #1-2 (Lee Ditko) since Ditko went that far, and I can't think of a reason not to include Spidey #30 - 33 for the master Planner series. Anyway, my own list is... #1 The Amazing Spider-Man #1-38, and Annuals #1-2 Still working on the others, probably Doc Strange Lee/Ditko and FF Lee/Kirby will go in there. I just don't like any comics the way I like those early Spideys. |
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Post by Cei-U! on Sept 7, 2015 7:46:01 GMT -5
Keeping in mind that this could easily change depending on the day you ask me and the mood I'm in: 2. The Amazing Spider-Man #1-28 and Annuals #1-2 (Lee/Ditko) Cei-U! I summon the faves! I have to think you meant The Amazing Spider-Man #1-38, and Annuals #1-2 (Lee Ditko) since Ditko went that far, and I can't think of a reason not to include Spidey #30 - 33 for the master Planner series. No, I meant exactly what I said. I feel both the plotting/writing and art slip a bit in those last ten issues. Unlike a lot of folks, I'm not especially enamored of the Master Planner arc, the reputation of which is based on one really great scene--Spidey lifting the machinery he's trapped under--rather than the overall quality of the story (IMO, natch). This shouldn't come as too big a surprise to our longtime posters, as I've also gone on record as not loving the Galactus trilogy, either. Cei-U! I summon the iconoclast! |
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Post by tingramretro on Sept 7, 2015 7:54:37 GMT -5
I'm shocked by all the big two focus. But I guess I'm still learning the demographics around here. Im with you there Trevor. Then again, before th e80ies, it's quite rare you'd get an extensive run on a series in the US outside of the big two. And a majority here seems to come from the late silver age and bronze age, at least from when they were discovering their love for comics If it had been about non classic US comicsTop 5 Runs, the result might have been quite different for most (I would have gone with 1/Prison Pit by Johnny Ryan, 2/Weasel by Dave Cooper, 3/The Frank/Fran series by Jim Woodring, 4/Velvet from Bru and Epting, 5/Lazarus from Rucka and Lark) Hang on...was this supposed to be US series only, then? That's not made clear in the OP, or I wouldn't have included Moore's Captain Britain run in my list. |
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Post by Slam_Bradley on Sept 7, 2015 16:32:11 GMT -5
I have to think you meant The Amazing Spider-Man #1-38, and Annuals #1-2 (Lee Ditko) since Ditko went that far, and I can't think of a reason not to include Spidey #30 - 33 for the master Planner series. No, I meant exactly what I said. I feel both the plotting/writing and art slip a bit in those last ten issues. Unlike a lot of folks, I'm not especially enamored of the Master Planner arc, the reputation of which is based on one really great scene--Spidey lifting the machinery he's trapped under--rather than the overall quality of the story (IMO, natch). This shouldn't come as too big a surprise to our longtime posters, as I've also gone on record as not loving the Galactus trilogy, either. Cei-U! I summon the iconoclast! I actually agree with this. There are a number of the later issues of Ditko's run on Amazing Spider-Man that I think are pretty awful. I couldn't pick them out without really thinking about it, as it's been a LONG time since I've read them, but I remember being pretty happy when Romita came on board because I was burned out on what Ditko was doing. |
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Post by Reptisaurus! on Sept 8, 2015 12:05:09 GMT -5
I have to think you meant The Amazing Spider-Man #1-38, and Annuals #1-2 (Lee Ditko) since Ditko went that far, and I can't think of a reason not to include Spidey #30 - 33 for the master Planner series. No, I meant exactly what I said. I feel both the plotting/writing and art slip a bit in those last ten issues. Unlike a lot of folks, I'm not especially enamored of the Master Planner arc, the reputation of which is based on one really great scene--Spidey lifting the machinery he's trapped under--rather than the overall quality of the story (IMO, natch). This shouldn't come as too big a surprise to our longtime posters, as I've also gone on record as not loving the Galactus trilogy, either. Cei-U! I summon the iconoclast! I generally agree on all counts (Except about Galactus, which is stone brilliant on every level) The thing about the Master Planner was that it wasn't funny. The best Lee/Ditko stories were really dark and hillarious and creepy and action packed all at once. Master Planner just feels, comparatively, fairly one-note. And it gets worse after that, of course. I tend to find myself skipping the parts with the all-somewhat-similar-villains and just looking for Gwen Stacy scenes! |
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Post by kongat44 on Sept 8, 2015 12:47:27 GMT -5
No, I meant exactly what I said. I feel both the plotting/writing and art slip a bit in those last ten issues. Unlike a lot of folks, I'm not especially enamored of the Master Planner arc, the reputation of which is based on one really great scene--Spidey lifting the machinery he's trapped under--rather than the overall quality of the story (IMO, natch). This shouldn't come as too big a surprise to our longtime posters, as I've also gone on record as not loving the Galactus trilogy, either. Cei-U! I summon the iconoclast! I generally agree on all counts (Except about Galactus, which is stone brilliant on every level) The thing about the Master Planner was that it wasn't funny. The best Lee/Ditko stories were really dark and hillarious and creepy and action packed all at once. Master Planner just feels, comparatively, fairly one-note. And it gets worse after that, of course. I tend to find myself skipping the parts with the all-somewhat-similar-villains and just looking for Gwen Stacy scenes! Well then I take it back, you do mean what you say. Well I agree with you guys that there is only one really good issue after #33, that is #37 Once Upon A Time there Was A Robot, and #38 Just a Guy Named Joe, is downright awful, however I think the master planner series was good, and tops off what Ditko was trying to do with Spider-Man, but I do include the others as it is part of the run. I don't like the issue where Daredevil hogs the entire story either, but again it is part of the run. When the comics were reprinted starting in 1982, I was also ready for Romita to take over, but got kind of a shock, when I thought his issues were all pretty terrible, the best one being #50, but for such a classic issue, it still relies on many steals form earlier issues, mainly #18, the End of Spider-Man, and the last scene with Jameson is right out of #13 The Menace of Mysterio. I find that some of the Peter scenes were good in the Romita, but not the Spidey scenes, the plotting was dull, and the pacing was deadly, especially those first 19 issues, it picked up starting at #50, but would go back and forth for the remainder of the series. One thing I liked about the Ditko issues, is that you never knew what was in store, it may be funny, or dramatic, usually fun, but with the Romita stories, it was always drama. After reading those early issues again, I think Ditko just is a better storyteller, and I wish he took a breather, then continued and showed us his version of The Green Goblin reveal. |
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Post by Roquefort Raider on Sept 8, 2015 14:17:58 GMT -5
Love and Rockets by the Hernandez brothers. It's simply mind-boggingly good.
Conan the barbarian by Roy Thomas and Barry Smith. The essence of my comics-reading youth.
Cerebus by Dave Sim, which is not only good, but also a pretty long run!
Preacher by Ennis and Dillon, a brilliant and iconoclastic piece of work.
Hellblazer by Sean Philips! (Mostly written by Paul Jenkins, but starting with a Jamie Delano issue and four Eddie Campbell-written ones. I think they qualify as one run since Phillips gives them a unified tone).
I wouldn't argue that these are the very best comic runs I ever came across; just that they're my personal favorite. The list would have been different a few years ago, and again a few years before that.
Honorable mentions:
Too numerous to list.
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Post by Slam_Bradley on Sept 8, 2015 14:26:04 GMT -5
Hellblazer by Sean Philips! (Mostly written by Paul Jenkins, but starting with a Jamie Delano issue and four Eddie Campbell-written ones. I think they qualify as one run since Phillips gives them a unified tone). Ennis/Dillon run of Hellblazer could have made my list. |
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Post by Roquefort Raider on Sept 8, 2015 14:36:43 GMT -5
Hellblazer by Sean Philips! (Mostly written by Paul Jenkins, but starting with a Jamie Delano issue and four Eddie Campbell-written ones. I think they qualify as one run since Phillips gives them a unified tone). Ennis/Dillon run of Hellblazer could have made my list. I loved that run, as well as the Ennis/Simpson one that preceded it. Hellblazer was a very good book until the end of the Jenkins run. |
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Post by Arthur Gordon Scratch on Sept 8, 2015 15:31:19 GMT -5
Hellblazer by Sean Philips! (Mostly written by Paul Jenkins, but starting with a Jamie Delano issue and four Eddie Campbell-written ones. I think they qualify as one run since Phillips gives them a unified tone). If I'm right, that early Jamie Delano issue you mention is really great, but... It's not by Delano! hahaha It's by John Smith, the very much underrated Tyranny Rex scribe. His major US work was the awefull Scarab mini at Vertigo. I say awefull because I bought it but actually never really read it as the artwork was some of the worst I've ever seen in a profesionnal big two comic. But that Hellblazer issue at the Lavoratory was really something. And Sean Philips killed it indeed, much more IMHO than on his later Jenkins run, which is in my opinion the second best of the whole series after Delano as it's really true to the character and investigating britain's folklore in a very unique way. I got into Hellblazer with the much hyped Ennis run, but in the long run, as good as it was back then, when I re-read the 300+ issues, along with Warren Ellis's run, it felt as the weakest, relying way too much on shock value Of the extand runs of Hellblazer, I rate them as follows : 1/ Delano, 2/ Jenkins, 3/ Milligan, 4/Carrey, 5/ Azzarelo, 6/ Ennis, 7/ Ellis, 8/ Diggle, 9/ Mina. |
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Post by Cei-U! on Sept 8, 2015 16:48:26 GMT -5
I generally agree on all counts (Except about Galactus, which is stone brilliant on every level) Except it really isn't. The basic idea is sound but I have several major objections (and one trivial one) to the Galactus Trilogy. 1. The structure. It starts midway through #48 and ends midway through #50, making it a "trilogy" that actually only makes up two issues' worth of pages. While it does create that sense of spontaneity I love about Kirby, this awkward pacing annoys me. 2. The FF are basically bystanders in their own story. Everything significant they accomplish is because the Watcher hands it to them and it's Alicia who turns the Silver Surfer against Galactus. 3. The miraculous coincidence at the heart of the plot: out of all the rooftops in New York the Surfer could land on, he just happens to land on Alicia's. Many years ago, I wrote a spec script for What If? asking what would've happened if Surfy had landed in Yancy Street instead. It didn't end well for a whole lot of folks. 4. The deus ex machina ending. Kirby's endings often suck, and the Ultimate Nullifier is a major offender. 5. The big G on the chest of the Big G. Yeah, yeah, I know somebody later explained it away as an alien glyph that coincidentally resembles our letter. But it adds an unwelcome and tonally inappropriate whiff of cheese to the proceedings. Not to say there isn't a lot to like about the trilogy. It's chockful of great individual scenes, there's some terrific character moments and, of course, Galactus and the Surfer are conceptually (and visually) amazing. I just don't see it as the apogee of the Lee/Kirby collaboration others do (as far as I'm concerned, they peaked with Avengers #3-4). Cei-U! I summon the seriously flawed masterpiece! |
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Post by Nowhere Man on Sept 8, 2015 20:52:45 GMT -5
It was a tough choice, but if I only had five runs to read, I'd choose:
Fantastic Four by John Byrne
Thor by Walt Simonson
X-Men by Chris Claremont and John Byrne
Sandman by Neil Gaiman
Swamp Thing by Alan Moore
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Post by Roquefort Raider on Sept 9, 2015 5:44:14 GMT -5
Hellblazer by Sean Philips! (Mostly written by Paul Jenkins, but starting with a Jamie Delano issue and four Eddie Campbell-written ones. I think they qualify as one run since Phillips gives them a unified tone). If I'm right, that early Jamie Delano issue you mention is really great, but... It's not by Delano! hahaha It's by John Smith, the very much underrated Tyranny Rex scribe. His major US work was the awefull Scarab mini at Vertigo. I say awefull because I bought it but actually never really read it as the artwork was some of the worst I've ever seen in a profesionnal big two comic. But that Hellblazer issue at the Lavoratory was really something. And Sean Philips killed it indeed, much more IMHO than on his later Jenkins run, which is in my opinion the second best of the whole series after Delano as it's really true to the character and investigating britain's folklore in a very unique way. I got into Hellblazer with the much hyped Ennis run, but in the long run, as good as it was back then, when I re-read the 300+ issues, along with Warren Ellis's run, it felt as the weakest, relying way too much on shock value Of the extand runs of Hellblazer, I rate them as follows : 1/ Delano, 2/ Jenkins, 3/ Milligan, 4/Carrey, 5/ Azzarelo, 6/ Ennis, 7/ Ellis, 8/ Diggle, 9/ Mina. Is that the one set in a laudromat? Then it's not the one I mean, even if it was indeed drawn by Philips. I'm referring to the story where we learn what kind of debt Chas has toward John, the one with Chas's mother and her terrible monkey. Pretty sure that was written by Delano. I fully agree with your criticism of Ellis's run, and especially the god awful "haunted" storyline. All attempted shock, graphic violence and no subtlety. Ellis did better with his stand alone issues, but even then I find his tenure on the mag quite forgettable. |
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