shaxper
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Post by shaxper on May 13, 2016 4:09:05 GMT -5
So I went to an LCS today to start a pool, nosed around the quarter bins and had I been so inclined I could have gotten about 40-50 different issues of the 2012 Valiant series from Harbinger to X-O to Shadowman to Harbinger Wars etc. out of those bins. I asked the owner why there was so much Valiant there and his response-it just didn't sell. We tried to promote it. We ordered in about 10 copies of each and didn't sell any beyond our pulls. We ordered in the $1 trial books and of all the different series and publishers and we brought in for that Valiant was the only one we sold zero copies of. We now only order it to pulls. We tried for a couple of years to move them as back issues but no one was jumping on, so we just put them in the quarter bins to try to get rid of them just before FCBD, and we're still not selling them, even tried to give some away on FCBD and no one was picking them up. I know it's only one shop (and it's a shop whose clientele leans more towards indy books than big2), but that doesn't sound like a line that is setting the world on fire and having a lot of growth potential. Their sales on the Diamond charts weren't spectacular to begin with, and if a lot of them are still sitting in stores in shelves rather then selling to end customers, those numbers don't indicate at all what the end customer totals are. -M Sad, but not entirely unexpected. A successful film can begin to change that, though. And there are still a lot of folks out there who read and love the original Valiant. Perhaps the demographic of the store you visited has an older clientele that never got swept up with the original company back in the early '90s. |
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Post by Batflunkie on May 13, 2016 7:31:25 GMT -5
I'd say that people might be disinterested in Valiant for the same reason they are Image, where it's just a glorified relic that got too bloated for it's own good. I mean some of the reviews for the Classic Omnibus' aren't exactly encouraging, especially considering that the ones for Eternal Warrior and Bloodshot just evaporated into the ether
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shaxper
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Posts: 22,871
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Post by shaxper on May 13, 2016 8:22:59 GMT -5
I'd say that people might be disinterested in Valiant for the same reason they are Image, where it's just a glorified relic that got too bloated for it's own good. It's been a while since I read any of the new Valiant (other than Faith), but my impression was never that the new properties were bloated or somehow subpar as compared to their earlier counterparts. I think Valiant was careful and purposeful in rolling out their titles slowly and deliberately, that each has been very carefully considered and well written (often surpassing the quality of the original), and I've been impressed by Valiant's willingness to continually shake up premises and not keep things stagnant. That being said, I just don't find most of the titles all that compelling -- at least not at $3.99 a pop. I can look at them and say "This is really quality stuff, and I respect what they're doing here," but I don't find myself hungering for more or missing it when I stop reading it. |
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Post by Batflunkie on May 13, 2016 8:29:45 GMT -5
Oh no, I don't think that personally (Jesus, I don't think I would make two threads about Valiant if I actually felt that way), I'm just stating what I believe is the general thought process behind people not wanting to buy something with the Valiant branding on it. But in reality, it could be a multitudinous cornucopia of different reasons, each as valid as the next
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Post by hondobrode on May 14, 2016 17:16:51 GMT -5
I don't get it.
I truly don't.
I'm going to be picking up the more recent issues to get caught up, and in a very rare move for me, will be paying full retail for them to help fully support them in the strongest way I can.
This is the best iteration of Valiant yet, and I've really enjoyed them all. Looking forward to reading the new 4001 A.D. series, Rai, and new character War Mother.
DC and Marvel don't need my direct support nearly as much, and I buy their output casually on sale, along with others, but Valiant I'm willing to support fully at full price, helping what little I can. They're the best universe I've followed. I appreciate that they've kept their stable small and controllable, the characters are consistent and engaging, and the creators are fantastic, whether they're currently with the Big Two or not.
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Post by hondobrode on May 17, 2016 21:43:26 GMT -5
Valiant announces a half dozen new series including 2 Harbinger-related titles, a new Peter Milligan character, another Divinity series, the Faith ongoing, a Turok-like Savage, and a Bloodshot stand alone event that sort of reminds me of Spider-Island.
The Milligan mini Brittania is the one that really sounds good to me.
Written by PETER MILLIGAN
Art by JUAN JOSE RYP
Cover by CARY NORD
PRESTIGE FORMAT LIMITED SERIES | BEGINNING SEPTEMBER 2016
On the fringes of civilization, the world's first detective is about to make an unholy discovery…
Ruled by the Fates. Manipulated by the Gods. Commanded by Caesar. In the year 65 A.D., one's destiny was not his own. At the height of Nero's reign, a veteran of Rome's imperial war machine has been dispatched to the farthest reaches of the colonies to investigate unnatural happenings… In the remote outpost of Britannia, Antonius Axia – the First Detective – will become Rome's only hope to reassert control over the empire's most barbaric frontier…and keep the monsters that bridge the line between myth and mystery at bay…
From comics mastermind Peter Milligan (X-Statix, Shade the Changing Man) and incendiary artist Juan Jose Ryp (NINJAK, Clone) comes a psychological journey into terror, temptation, and bloodshed – presented in an all-new prestige format limited series!
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Post by Batflunkie on May 18, 2016 11:46:19 GMT -5
Not to sound snobbish or anything, but I've know about Savage and Britannia for a long time, maybe about a year. I'm weary of Milligan been given the keys to this Futuristic Victorian take on Magnus: Robot Fighter after how he utterly massacared Shadowman. IDK, but with his new Vertigo book, New Romancer, he might actually pull it off though and prove me wrong
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Post by hondobrode on May 18, 2016 12:41:48 GMT -5
There's nothing I've just hated including Milligan's Shadowman.
These new titles have been in the works for awhile, but they were officially announced Monday.
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Post by String on May 19, 2016 9:32:10 GMT -5
I think part of Valiant's problem is the bias of the major comic news sites. Take CBR for example. They may publish the occasional info piece or even interview concerning an upcoming Valiant big event or new title(s). But their reviews of Valiant titles are infrequent. CBR has never published any of Valiant's upcoming solicitations unlike they do with other major publishers. And why is ComicsAlliance been one of the few sites to provide articles of any kind serving as guides for possible new readers (and old fans) to the new Valiant Universe?
Newsarama will publish their solicitations but the only site that I've seen with any extensive Valiant coverage (for what it's worth) is Bleeding Cool. So I see their overall lack of proper coverage as a hindrance to Valiant's efforts to grow.
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Post by Batflunkie on May 19, 2016 10:12:49 GMT -5
The job of "news sites" is to cover what they feel is relavant to their readerbase. I'm not entirely sure at what point bias factors into it, not that I'm disagreeing with you because that is an actual issue, but it seems like they already put their own "spin" on it long before they put pen to paper. The Outhouse is a tounge in cheek site that I trust to give it to me straight about as much as I trust Fox News to not to entirely fabricate stories like an already formed turd in the shape of a balloon animal. At least folks at The Outhouse don't take themselves too seriously and can be rather humourous sometimes
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Post by Deleted on May 19, 2016 15:57:32 GMT -5
I think part of Valiant's problem is the bias of the major comic news sites. Take CBR for example. They may publish the occasional info piece or even interview concerning an upcoming Valiant big event or new title(s). But their reviews of Valiant titles are infrequent. CBR has never published any of Valiant's upcoming solicitations unlike they do with other major publishers. And why is ComicsAlliance been one of the few sites to provide articles of any kind serving as guides for possible new readers (and old fans) to the new Valiant Universe? Newsarama will publish their solicitations but the only site that I've seen with any extensive Valiant coverage (for what it's worth) is Bleeding Cool. So I see their overall lack of proper coverage as a hindrance to Valiant's efforts to grow. CBR is all about clicks and advertising revenue. If they do a Valiant story and it doesn't get a lot of traffic, they don't do many more stories on Valiant. The more clicks and traffic they get on stories, the more they can charge for advertising on the site which generates their revenue. If people going to CBR clicked on stories about Valiant more, it would get more coverage. The Diamond big 5 publishers will always get more play there because they have larger fanbases that provide more traffic and thus provide more opportunity for CBR to generate revenue. Yes it means its harder for Valiant to get growth, but they don't generate enough interest to elbow into the playing time of the big boys (i.e. the revenue generators) and there's not a large enough grass roots base behind it to change that. Their fanbase is very lour, but it is not very large, which is why their sales have peaked and then plateaued where they are. To get more time at CBR, they would have to bring more people to the party, they don't. -M |
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shaxper
CCF Site Custodian
Posts: 22,871
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Post by shaxper on May 21, 2016 11:33:03 GMT -5
I think part of Valiant's problem is the bias of the major comic news sites. Take CBR for example. They may publish the occasional info piece or even interview concerning an upcoming Valiant big event or new title(s). But their reviews of Valiant titles are infrequent. CBR has never published any of Valiant's upcoming solicitations unlike they do with other major publishers. And why is ComicsAlliance been one of the few sites to provide articles of any kind serving as guides for possible new readers (and old fans) to the new Valiant Universe? Newsarama will publish their solicitations but the only site that I've seen with any extensive Valiant coverage (for what it's worth) is Bleeding Cool. So I see their overall lack of proper coverage as a hindrance to Valiant's efforts to grow. CBR is all about clicks and advertising revenue. If they do a Valiant story and it doesn't get a lot of traffic, they don't do many more stories on Valiant. The more clicks and traffic they get on stories, the more they can charge for advertising on the site which generates their revenue. If people going to CBR clicked on stories about Valiant more, it would get more coverage. The Diamond big 5 publishers will always get more play there because they have larger fanbases that provide more traffic and thus provide more opportunity for CBR to generate revenue. Yes it means its harder for Valiant to get growth, but they don't generate enough interest to elbow into the playing time of the big boys (i.e. the revenue generators) and there's not a large enough grass roots base behind it to change that. Their fanbase is very lour, but it is not very large, which is why their sales have peaked and then plateaued where they are. To get more time at CBR, they would have to bring more people to the party, they don't. -M Thus the problem with news in general. How often is it informing us, and how often is it finding it more profitable to just tell us about the things we already know, reinforcing the opinions we already agree with? Thus the reason I prefer to hear about comics from you guys. I actually learn that way. |
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Post by hondobrode on May 21, 2016 12:16:39 GMT -5
Besides CBR & Newsarama, there's Comics Alliance, and also The Beatand The Comics ReporterBoth of these sites give a little broader scope of what's happening outside of The Diamond 5. |
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Post by Deleted on May 21, 2016 13:01:35 GMT -5
CBR is all about clicks and advertising revenue. If they do a Valiant story and it doesn't get a lot of traffic, they don't do many more stories on Valiant. The more clicks and traffic they get on stories, the more they can charge for advertising on the site which generates their revenue. If people going to CBR clicked on stories about Valiant more, it would get more coverage. The Diamond big 5 publishers will always get more play there because they have larger fanbases that provide more traffic and thus provide more opportunity for CBR to generate revenue. Yes it means its harder for Valiant to get growth, but they don't generate enough interest to elbow into the playing time of the big boys (i.e. the revenue generators) and there's not a large enough grass roots base behind it to change that. Their fanbase is very lour, but it is not very large, which is why their sales have peaked and then plateaued where they are. To get more time at CBR, they would have to bring more people to the party, they don't. -M Thus the problem with news in general. How often is it informing us, and how often is it finding it more profitable to just tell us about the things we already know, reinforcing the opinions we already agree with? Thus the reason I prefer to hear about comics from you guys. I actually learn that way. Well CBR evolved from a fan based "zine" site into a marketing machine for the industry-it never really was about the news except as a means to draw people to the site. It was never intended as a journalism site, it was a Kingdom Come fan site that got a lot of traffic and began issuing press releases from the major publishers and then expanded into a place where publishers could promote books to the fan base. Any expectation or belief it was a "news" site in the traditional sense is the audience bringing their own biases to the table. It was always pretty clear what was being posted was more marketing than reporting. Newsarama portrayed itself as a comic news site, but was cut from the same cloth as CBR (and was the birthplace of Rich Johnson's Lying in the Gutters gossip column that eventually spawned Bleeding Cool, which gives you a sense of the type of "news" it dealt in)-but Comic Book Resources always portrayed itself as a place to go to to find out what the comic buzz was and buzz is marketing not news. Who were the creators people were excited about, what books would they be working on, which books were going to be coming out with what creative teams and what would be the books everyone should be reading, etc. etc. and as comics Hollywood presence grew and created more buzz, more of that came into play at CBR. The news was used to create buzz, but the point was the buzz, not the news there. It never really was a news site. -M |
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Post by Batflunkie on May 21, 2016 14:14:34 GMT -5
Well CBR evolved from a fan based "zine" site into a marketing machine for the industry-it never really was about the news except as a means to draw people to the site. It was never intended as a journalism site, it was a Kingdom Come fan site that got a lot of traffic and began issuing press releases from the major publishers and then expanded into a place where publishers could promote books to the fan base. Any expectation or belief it was a "news" site in the traditional sense is the audience bringing their own biases to the table. It was always pretty clear what was being posted was more marketing than reporting. Wow, that sounds incredibly similar to "certain" comic book distributor that Marvel bought out and got rid of once they filed for bankruptcy....*rolls eyes* And it's weird to think of how popular Kingdom Come must have been back in it's heyday, I swear, sometimes it feels like I was born too late in history to appreciate the significance of some comics |
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