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Post by Slam_Bradley on Jan 11, 2023 16:30:31 GMT -5
Apparently it's not a problem.
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Post by Cei-U! on Jan 11, 2023 18:03:14 GMT -5
Remember that Larry Lieber's original quote was "Whosoever holds this hammer, if he be wothy, shall possess the power of Thor."In other words, anybody could pick it up but only someone worthy would gain superhuman strength, control over the storm, etc. It was Stan who misinterpreted that to mean only someone worthy could lift Mjolnir.
Cei-U! I summon the fine rrint!
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Post by commond on Jan 11, 2023 18:32:00 GMT -5
I like Stan's version better. It gives an Excalibur-like quality to Mjolnir.
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Post by Icctrombone on Jan 12, 2023 5:31:05 GMT -5
This will clear it up
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Post by kirby101 on Jan 12, 2023 9:24:35 GMT -5
If Leiber wrote the script, and Kirby drew and plotted JIM #83, how did Stan Lee create Thor?
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Post by Cei-U! on Jan 12, 2023 9:31:11 GMT -5
If Leiber wrote the script, and Kirby drew and plotted JIM #83, how did Stan Lee create Thor? According to Lieber (who always produced a full script, even for stories he drew himself, and rarely, if ever, worked "Marvel method"), he used a brief plot outline provided by Stan that summarized a plotting session between Stan and Jack.
Cei-U! Heard him say this with my own ears!
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Post by tonebone on Jan 12, 2023 9:48:52 GMT -5
"You don't know his life!" always cracks me up. I have always suspected that BBT haters hate it because it gets a little too close to the truth.
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Post by Icctrombone on Jan 12, 2023 9:50:39 GMT -5
It’s brilliant.
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Post by kirby101 on Jan 12, 2023 10:48:26 GMT -5
A good article on why Thorn was mostly Kirby's creation and how weak Stan's claim of creation is weak. We see that Kirby had used Thor before, several times. But the man who should no previous inclination for Norse mythology said "Let's do Thor.", sure Stan. TALES OF THE UNEXPECTED #16, 1957
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Post by Hoosier X on Jan 12, 2023 10:56:24 GMT -5
“Let’s call him the god of thunder!”
Whatever you say, Stan!
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Post by Cei-U! on Jan 12, 2023 11:18:46 GMT -5
True, but the idea of making Thor a comic book super-hero predates any of Kirby's uses of the character. And Stan did make contributions to Thor as we know him so at the very least he deserves a co-developer title, if not co-cretor.
Cei-U! I summon the nuance!
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Post by kirby101 on Jan 12, 2023 12:08:34 GMT -5
I have no problem with Stan being credited with co-developer on any of these. The problem, and it has great financial repercussions, is his claims of being the sole or main creator.
When we think of Man-Thing, we think of Steve Gerber and Mike Ploog, who developed the comic into what made it a favorite. But Man-Thing was created by Gerry Conway, Gray Morrow, Roy Thomas and Stan Lee.
That is why the "but Stan's dialog and editing" argument is irrelevant to the who created discussion.
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Post by EdoBosnar on Jan 12, 2023 12:21:41 GMT -5
Incredible Hulk #2 (1978)On the heels of reading the first late ‘70s Incredible Hulk paperback that reprints the 6-issue original series, I immediately jumped to this follow-up book. Now, this volume is unusual, because instead of starting with the Tales to Astonish #60, when the Hulk again began to appear in an ongoing series, this one reprints the 10-page Hulk stories from Tales to Astonish #85-99. It’s never been clear to me why this particular stretch of stories was chosen for this second volume, but I’m glad they were. That’s because I really like the art in this book. The first three stories were drawn by none other than John Buscema, and inked by John Tartaglione (TtA 85) and then Mike Esposito (TtA 86-87). John’s kid brother Sal is my definitive Hulk artist, but as one would expect, Big John was no slouch at rendering ol’ Jade Jaws. These first three installments involve the Hulk dealing with a test nuclear missile rerouted by a spy to head for New York instead of the ocean, and then battle a robot called the Humanoid that was built by the Leader and activated by that nincompoop Gen. Ross in the hopes that it could take out the Hulk - it does, sort of, but also goes on a rampage. The next four stories, from TtA 88-91, were drawn by Gil Kane (both pencils and inks). Then as now, I liked the art here the best. I later learned that there are a number of fans who really did not like Kane’s work on the Hulk, but I found it quite good – but then again, I’m just a big fan of Kane’s art in general. In these stories, the Hulk first has to deal with Boomerang, who upgraded his equipment and thinks he can now take down the Green Goliath (spoiler: he can’t). Then he’s accosted by the Stranger, who puts him under mind control to go on a rampage and destroy all major infrastructure and weapons systems on the planet so the Stranger can then purge most human life and start all over again, but then the Abomination also shows up (his first appearance) and things don’t quite go as planned for anyone. The rest of the stories were drawn by Marie Severin, and inked by Frank Giacoia (TtA 92-93), Herb Trimpe (TtA 94-98) and John Tartaglione (TtA 99). These start out pretty cosmic, as the Hulk first has a run-in with the Silver Surfer, and then gets abducted by some agents of the High Evolutionary, who put him on a rocket ship to Wundagore II. While there, he tussled with a bunch of the renegade Knights of Wundagore and then got sent back to Earth by a super-evolved High Evolutionary. And back on Earth, he became embroiled in a plot by the Legion of the Living Lightning, briefly agreeing to help them take on the US military (again putting him at odds with Gen. Ross and Major Glen Talbot) before he figured out that he was being double-crossed.
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Post by Cei-U! on Jan 12, 2023 12:46:42 GMT -5
Gil Kane does one of my favorite versions of the Hulk but, as always, I prefer pretty much anyone you can name on inks instead of Kane himself. Still, those TTA stories he drew, especially the ones with Abomination, are powerful!
Cei-U! I summon the green gargantuas!
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Post by kirby101 on Jan 12, 2023 13:06:18 GMT -5
I love Kane's self inked work. I prefer almost every artist when they ink themselves. An exception would be Don Heck, who looks better on the superhero books with almost anyone else inking him. John Buscema was good self inking and had a nice loose quality, but I liked him better with other inkers.
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