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Post by Icctrombone on Jul 7, 2023 14:31:28 GMT -5
Dillin’s OK. I didn’t read JLA in the 1970s, but it sure wasn’t Dick Dillin’s fault. I think it was. A more dynamic artist could have elevated the material.
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Post by Cei-U! on Jul 7, 2023 14:57:19 GMT -5
Dillin’s OK. I didn’t read JLA in the 1970s, but it sure wasn’t Dick Dillin’s fault. I think it was. A more dynamic artist could have elevated the material. Have you ever seen his pencils? His work was much more graceful and nuanced than the finished product ever demonstrated. For some reason, DC just couldn't (wouldn't?) match him with an appropriate inker. I'll never be a big Dillin booster but I think he is unjustly maligned.
Cei-U! I summon the underappreciated workhorse!
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Post by Icctrombone on Jul 7, 2023 15:07:48 GMT -5
I think it was. A more dynamic artist could have elevated the material. Have you ever seen his pencils? His work was much more graceful and nuanced than the finished product ever demonstrated. For some reason, DC just couldn't (wouldn't?) match him with an appropriate inker. I'll never be a big Dillin booster but I think he is unjustly maligned.
Cei-U! I summon the underappreciated workhorse!
The only time I tolerated his work was when Dick Giordano inked it in issue 102. His layouts were the problem.
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Post by spoon on Jul 7, 2023 20:47:55 GMT -5
Uncanny X-Men #209-220, or the mutant massacre and its aftermath. This arc deeply altered the status quo for the X-Men, a really gutsy move (although failed attempt, in my opinion). The story aged better than I remembered. The opening chapters, with the Morlocks being all but exterminated, was very gripping; it felt a little gratuitous but certainly dramatic. Kitty, Nightcrawler and Colossus all end up incapacitated for the foreseeable future, and are eventually replaced by Psylocke, Dazzler, Longshot and Havok. The team also changes its core mission (allying with the Hellfire club, among other things). As said above, this change in a formula that had made the book one of Marvel's top sellers was pretty daring; I'm sure that writer Chris Claremont meant to rejuvenate the title before it risked becoming stale. The problem is that Psylocke was a sympathetic but rather bland charater, Havok never really grew into his own, Longshot was ill-suited for a superhero team and Dazzler was downright annoying. Furthermore, unlike earlier steps in the evolution of the X-Men, this one didn't feel organic; those new characters felt imposed. Making matters worse is that a lot of major plot lines were dropped in one go. What will happen to Kitty and Nightcrawler? You need to read other comics to find out. What about the entire supporting cast? Never mind them. What about Colossus? Oh, he'll be back... except that when he draws melancholy pictures of the team he means to rejoin, it's all about Psylocke, Dazzler et al... It's as if the old team never existed! That's very jarring to old readers. For my money, the most interesting character from that period is Madelyne Pryor. Too bad she would eventually be sacrificed to the reborn Phoenix/X-Factor nonsense. Strictly sticking to the story, a problem I had was with how the new bad guys, the Marauders, seem unduly successful in killing the Morlocks and crippling the X-Men. They're clearly aided by the greatest of superpowers: the writer's fiat. Remember: at the time, Magneto had replaced Xavier as the school's headmaster; why would the X-Men rush to the Morlocks' aid without that incredible asset? ("gotta stay at the school to pritect the New Mutants", yeah, right). The Marauders consist of a strong woman, a guy who scrambles powers, a dude who throws taser-like harpoons, a fellow who shoots a gun and a vertigo-inducing woman. Plus Sabretooth, a bit later. Magneto could easily trap them all in a big ball of girders, the Morlock Leech could deprive them of their powers, Kitty could phase most of them through the floor and so on and so forth. Our poor heroes didn't think this one through! Art-wise, this run also saw the transition between John Romita Jr and Marc Silvestri as regular penciller. Alan Davis, Bret Blevins, Rick Leonardi, Barry Windsor-Smith and Jackson Guice held the fort honourably, but rotating artists are never good for a title. And boy! Do I notice Claremontisms nowadays! I did a similar re-read (#210-219) last year. The I binged New Mutants earlier this year. I think Claremont accidentally gave us some profound storytelling with Magneto. I think he loves the idea of portraying Magneto as noble. But since Magneto would've often made the heroes too powerful, I think he left him out or limited his role in some stories. In effect, we get a Magento who puts himself first and isn't there for the X-Men or the New Mutants, which is probably a better take than "well, actually this terrorist is a great guy who should be in charge of a school." Because while he supposedly has to protect the New Mutants while the Mutant Massacre is going on, he doesn't and they end up being chased through time and space and Limbo by Warlock's father Magus. The idea of allying with the Hellfire Club is screwy. How many people, for instance, had Selene murdered at that point? Like Commond, I started reading X-Men when the newbies were on the roster (but towards the end of their time, so people like Havok and Dazzler seemed like genuine X-Men to me. When I was assembling my X-Men collection, one of the first back issues I really loved was #218, with Rogue leading three of the new members. (I didn't get #217 until years later). Yeah, it's a little funky that the new group of villains could beat the crap out of the X-Men so quickly. But in Inferno, the roles are reversed. And because the intros of Psylocke and Longshot to the x-books happen in a New Mutants annual and an X-Men annual, someone just reading the monthly title wouldn't get the full picture of what was going ont.
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Post by jester on Jul 10, 2023 10:18:54 GMT -5
Amazing Spider-Man #71 Script-Stan Lee, Layouts/Finishes-John Romita Sr./Jim Mooney Spider-Man is wanted by the police for causing Jonah to have an attack after losing his cool and threatening him, and being framed by The Kingpin for a crime in the previous issue. Quicksilver, looking to prove that he's a good guy to the Avengers after his alliance with Magneto, decides to capture Spidey. They have a misunderstanding fight, and then patch things up. On the subplot side of things, with Jonah in the hospital, Robbie takes over as acting editor of the Bugle. He buys photos from Peter proving that the Kingpin was guilty and not Spider-Man, paying him more than Jonah usually does. There's a funny scene where we see Jonah reacting to this in the hospital. The Toad and the Scarlet Witch also appear in a flashback scene where they are shown hanging around with Quicksilver. The Toad seems to have completely abadoned his loyalty to Magneto and become friends with the twins. All in all, it's classic Spidey. Cool superhero plot, interesting focus on sub-plots and the supporting cast members, and nice Romita/Mooney art.
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Post by Rob Allen on Jul 10, 2023 14:53:47 GMT -5
Last week I finished a re-read of Marvel's 4-part adaptation of Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade... This reminded me of something I read a few years ago, about one of the real-life "Last Crusades", also known as the Crusade of Nicopolis, which happened in 1396. I read about it in Barbara Tuchman's book A Distant Mirror: The Calamitous 14th Century. It occurs to me that a graphic adaptation of this book would be a terrific idea. The book centers on the colorful life of Enguerrand VII de Coucy, who was one of the leaders of the Crusade. I'd love to see a good artist illustrate the story of his life. Does the comics industry have a suggestion box?
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Post by Farrar on Jul 10, 2023 18:59:59 GMT -5
Amazing Spider-Man #71 ... The Toad and the Scarlet Witch also appear in a flashback scene where they are shown hanging around with Quicksilver. The Toad seems to have completely abandoned his loyalty to Magneto and become friends with the twins. Several months earlier, in Avengers #53 (the conclusion to an Avengers-X-Men multi-issue crossover arc), the Toad rebelled against Magneto. Here are the last two pages of Avengers #53's story: After Avengers #53 Wanda and Pietro were MIA (except for a couple of Avengers pin-ups), so when they popped up in ASM #71 I was mighty relieved that Marvel hadn't forgotten about them!
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Post by tonebone on Jul 11, 2023 9:43:36 GMT -5
Amazing Spider-Man #71 ... The Toad and the Scarlet Witch also appear in a flashback scene where they are shown hanging around with Quicksilver. The Toad seems to have completely abandoned his loyalty to Magneto and become friends with the twins. Several months earlier, in Avengers #53 (the conclusion to an Avengers-X-Men multi-issue crossover arc), the Toad rebelled against Magneto. Here are the last two pages of Avengers #53's story: After Avengers #53 Wanda and Pietro were MIA (except for a couple of Avengers pin-ups), so when they popped up in ASM #71 I was mighty relieved that Marvel hadn't forgotten about them! Fantastic art! And color!
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Post by Farrar on Jul 11, 2023 16:29:24 GMT -5
Fantastic art! And color! I know, right? Pencils by Big John Buscema, inks by George Tuska.
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Post by Icctrombone on Jul 11, 2023 17:00:03 GMT -5
After Avengers #53 Wanda and Pietro were MIA (except for a couple of Avengers pin-ups), so when they popped up in ASM #71 I was mighty relieved that Marvel hadn't forgotten about them! It was a good idea for Magneto to make a non metal ship just to prove he could. Whatever...
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Post by Roquefort Raider on Jul 12, 2023 12:44:47 GMT -5
After Avengers #53 Wanda and Pietro were MIA (except for a couple of Avengers pin-ups), so when they popped up in ASM #71 I was mighty relieved that Marvel hadn't forgotten about them! It was a good idea for Magneto to make a non metal ship just to prove he could. Whatever... Yeah, what a convenient plot-driven coincidence!!! Perhaps Toad isn't all that big on metallurgy and just means the ship isn't made of steel. It could be mostly built out of aluminium and lithium (to make it lighter) or titanium (to make it more solid). Or he simply noticed that Magneto couldn't levitate it or something, and assumed it must be made of plastic. Or... the writer just needed an excuse for Magneto to fall down without having to shell out no-prizes!
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Post by Icctrombone on Jul 12, 2023 18:41:56 GMT -5
It was a good idea for Magneto to make a non metal ship just to prove he could. Whatever... Yeah, what a convenient plot-driven coincidence!!! Perhaps Toad isn't all that big on metallurgy and just means the ship isn't made of steel. It could be mostly built out of aluminium and lithium (to make it lighter) or titanium (to make it more solid). Or he simply noticed that Magneto couldn't levitate it or something, and assumed it must be made of plastic. Or... the writer just needed an excuse for Magneto to fall down without having to shell out no-prizes! It makes me think that sometimes writers didn't have an ending for particular stories.
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Post by spoon on Jul 12, 2023 22:12:47 GMT -5
I read Daredevil #351-364, which is the remainder of the Daredevil Epic Collection vol. 20: Purgatory & Paradise TPB that I had started.
Daredevil #351 and #352 are a couple of fill-ins to bridge the gap between the DeMatteis run and the Kesel run. Shawn McManus draws both with John Rozum writing the first and Ben Raab. They're both remarkable, but the #351 is a bit better. Unfortunately, someone working on #351 didn't realize Turk is African-American. I believe Mastermind has two daughters who have been villains, one of whom shows up in #352. It's a bad fit, and Raab uses the bad move of having a random villain know the heroes identity out of nowhere. The ending is also nonsensical.
That leads me to a run I actually read most of when it came out: the Karl Kesel/Cary Nord run. After DeMatteis put an end to the Jack Batlin era, Kesel established the new old status quo. Matt is now known to be alive. His explanation is that Nick Fury directed him to fake his death to hide out from the Kingpin. Matt and Foggy are partners again. Matt and Karen are an item, although that part began with DeMatteis. It has a retro feel. DD is wisecracking like in the Silver Age, and a lot of the jokes are actually funny. He doesn't suffer nearly as much as he often does. There's not nearly so much peril. A lot of the villains are classics, but not necessarily folks with a long track record with DD.
But there are some changes. We get some new supporting cast members, including attorney Rosalind Sharpe who plays an antagonistic role in the Matt Murdock scenes as domineering new senior partner. Misty Knight is a recurring character, and Liz Allan is a potential love interest for Foggy Nelson. We get an actual legal dilemma as Matt defends Mister Hyde in court. After spending much of Chichester run as an anti-porn activist, most of the Kesel run features Karen searching for and getting a paying job. There's a big fake-out, but one of the highlights of the run is an issue (#359) that centers on Karen at her job. She uses the name Paige Angel, a bit of a counterpoint to Daredevil.
It doesn't the avalanche of guest stars to goose sales that we saw in the latter Chichester/McDaniel period, but we do have a couple references to larger Marvel Universe events. There's a Ben Reilly Spider-Man guest appearance. In a post-Onslaught, Black Widow is troubled by the weight of the Avengers' apparent deaths. Also, Kesel gets creative in showing how the disappearance of other heroes impacts DD.
Cary Nord has a very distinctive style. I don't know quite to describe it. It's not photo-realistic, but it's a bit closer to that on the continuum than it is to the cartoony. He's very good at both the action sequences and especially the normal Matt Murdock scenes and inter-personal interactions. He gives Karen Page some very mid-90s styling. He was very early in his career and an interview in the end matter mentions how fought deadlines as he entered the business. Maybe that's why a couple issues have half the pages drawn by guest pencilers (Steve Epting and Rick Leonardi). Also, a couple issues credit other artists with layouts. Those issues don't actually look different from Nord's other issues to me, either in rendering or how the pages are laid out.
I wish Kesel and Nord had more time to develop what they working. But reading the run, I think I can guess at why it only lasted about a year. It moves at a leisurely pace and it seems like Kesel is slowly building up the new status quo. The peril is momentary and not very grievous. It's not all flowers and sunshine though, as Hyde comes across as a disturbing character. We don't get big cover-labeled events. Rather, than high profile guest stars, it's more of an economical deployment of less prominent characters associated with other titles, like Liz Allan, Misty Knight, and the Molten Man. As much as I like Nord's art, it's a contrast to 90s Image-type superhero art.
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Post by wildfire2099 on Jul 13, 2023 6:31:53 GMT -5
Yeah, what a convenient plot-driven coincidence!!! Perhaps Toad isn't all that big on metallurgy and just means the ship isn't made of steel. It could be mostly built out of aluminium and lithium (to make it lighter) or titanium (to make it more solid). Or he simply noticed that Magneto couldn't levitate it or something, and assumed it must be made of plastic. Or... the writer just needed an excuse for Magneto to fall down without having to shell out no-prizes! It makes me think that sometimes writers didn't have an ending for particular stories. I think it that case someone pointed out 'uhhhh..how can Magneto lose his grip from a metal ship?' And they decided to address it.
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Post by Roquefort Raider on Jul 13, 2023 7:48:39 GMT -5
It makes me think that sometimes writers didn't have an ending for particular stories. I think it that case someone pointed out 'uhhhh..how can Magneto lose his grip from a metal ship?' And they decided to address it. Very likely. In this particular case, however, I think it would have been better to leave things unexplained and let readers figure it out. The mention of an ad hoc ship made of non-metallic materials (made just to prove it could be done to boot!) is a bit ridiculous and doesn't explain why Magneto doesn't gently levitate away (as he's done on many other occasions) instead of just falling. Had I seen that scene without explanation as a kid, and had I even noticed that Mags should not be beaten so easily, I'd have assumed that he was simply tired of the recent battle and did not manage to summon enough concentration to use his powers before hitting the ground. The ship seems to be 20 m above the rocks at best, so he'd go splat in about 2 seconds.
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