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Post by sabongero on Jun 5, 2016 18:49:40 GMT -5
In your opinion, what would "Truth, Justice, and the American Way" mean in the different decades (30's, 40's, 50's, 60's, 70's, 80's, 90's, 2000's, 2010's)?
I was just reading All Star Superman and Superman Rebirth. And then I just happened to read an old Action comic book from the late 1980's. When I typed Superman in youtube, I was brought to the old 50's series of George Reeves, and the introduction always had "Truth, Justice, and the American Way." It led me to think about that classic catchphrase.
Superman is indeed a symbol of truth and justice. It always has and it always will. He is also a symbol of hope and inspiration.
As for "The American Way," that would depend on the opinion and interpretation given from which time, and I would suppose from which demographic and tax bracket of society that would be giving that opinion. In the 1950's perception of good and evil was somewhat more black and white than what it is today in modern society, which is more covered in the gray area, an amalgamation of good and evil. We are in a more modern, more cynical, and dare I say more "darker" time where the perception of an anti-hero is more popular and accepted than that of a scrupulous individual.
Feel free to post your opinion of "Truth, Justice, and the American Way" and the decade(s) you are citing your opinion of this catchphrase.
Thanks in advance to everyone's post.
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Post by tingramretro on Jun 6, 2016 0:40:12 GMT -5
No idea. I have never been entirely sure what the American way was, or in what respect it differed from anybody else's way.
In the rather insular and snobbish village of Woolverstone, about five miles from me, there's a sign outside the church inviting people to "worship the Woolverstone way", which I find similarly puzzling. I find myself imagining robed, cowled figures practicing satanic rites every time I see it...
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Post by coke & comics on Jun 6, 2016 2:29:06 GMT -5
Relevant to the discussion is the use of the phrase. Originally, on the radio and in the animated shorts, Superman fought "a never-ending battle for truth and justice". The phrase would later be amended. goodcomics.comicbookresources.com/2010/09/03/comic-book-legends-revealed-276/3/Various odd takes have been tried over the years. I think it was Gerry Conway who described him as fighting for "truth, justice, and the Terran way!" Ouch. |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 6, 2016 6:19:38 GMT -5
To me, the American Way implied Freedom for all and having said that the writer of the comic book is trying to embrace patriotism to all American People. The American Way can be viewed anyway you slice it and there is no wrong way of interpreting it and therefore in my own upbringing it's provokes loyalty to the American Way of Life. However, I have mixed feelings about this and even so it's stirring in it's own fashion it's can make certain groups angry to the core. And that why they drop the American Way and replace it with freedom.
Freedom means a lot to people and I for one can see applied to Superman because he is their only hope for a better tomorrow. I didn't read a lot of Superman from 1990 and on because of the constant changing of the Man of Steel persona and having said that I have great difficulty of Superman once denouncing his American Citizenship and started handling things differently and that's angered a lot of readers and I can understand that.
But to me, he's like a savior to all mankind and that's the beauty of Superman because he has great powers - far greater than any ordinary man and that's can be a blessing to all that received his help. In my own knowledge of Superman ... he is the Earth's Greatest Protector without Superman there is no hope and no freedom for all mankind.
I know that I may sound corny to you ... but that's how I see Superman in my own understanding of all the things that he stands for.
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Post by tingramretro on Jun 6, 2016 7:36:25 GMT -5
To me, the American Way implied Freedom for all and having said that the writer of the comic book is trying to embrace patriotism to all American People. The American Way can be viewed anyway you slice it and there is no wrong way of interpreting it and therefore in my own upbringing it's provokes loyalty to the American Way of Life. However, I have mixed feelings about this and even so it's stirring in it's own fashion it's can make certain groups angry to the core. And that why they drop the American Way and replace it with freedom. Freedom means a lot to people and I for one can see applied to Superman because he is their only hope for a better tomorrow. I didn't read a lot of Superman from 1990 and on because of the constant changing of the Man of Steel persona and having said that I have great difficulty of Superman once denouncing his American Citizenship and started handling things differently and that's angered a lot of readers and I can understand that. But to me, he's like a savior to all mankind and that's the beauty of Superman because he has great powers - far greater than any ordinary man and that's can be a blessing to all that received his help. In my own knowledge of Superman ... he is the Earth's Greatest Protector without Superman there is no hope and no freedom for all mankind. I know that I may sound corny to you ... but that's how I see Superman in my own understanding of all the things that he stands for. Sorry, aren't us non Americans equally free? I certainly feel free. Even my healthcare is free. In what way is the American way of life any different to the British, German, French, Belgian, Australian, Italian, Norwegian, Dutch, Irish, Spanish or Canadian way of life? |
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Post by foxley on Jun 6, 2016 8:02:05 GMT -5
According to Marvel, the 'American way' means NASCAR and American Idol. According to Civil War, Captain America does not truly represent America because he did not know about NASCAR and American Idol.
Is there really any way Marvel could have made that awful story even more ludicrous?
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Post by tingramretro on Jun 6, 2016 8:03:08 GMT -5
According to Marvel, the 'American way' means NASCAR and American Idol. According to Civil War, Captain America does not truly represent America because he did not know about NASCAR and American Idol. Is there really any way Marvel could have made that awful story even more ludicrous? I don't know what either of those things are, either... |
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Post by foxley on Jun 6, 2016 8:20:25 GMT -5
American Idol is like Britain's Got Talent or The X Factor. NASCAR is the Americans somehow finding a way to strip everything of interest out of motorsport.
Neither should really have any bearing on Steve Rogers ability to be Captain America.
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Post by tingramretro on Jun 6, 2016 8:46:43 GMT -5
American Idol is like Britain's Got Talent or The X Factor. NASCAR is the Americans somehow finding a way to strip everything of interest out of motorsport. Neither should really have any bearing on Steve Rogers ability to be Captain America. If I thought Captain Britain represented Britain's Got Talent or The X-Factor, I'd willingly shoot him myself. |
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Post by Prince Hal on Jun 6, 2016 8:56:25 GMT -5
Relevant to the discussion is the use of the phrase. Originally, on the radio and in the animated shorts, Superman fought "a never-ending battle for truth and justice". The phrase would later be amended. So "the American way" was added to the radio show during the war, retired after the war and then reappeared on the TV, which debuted in 1952. Because Communism? Just a guess. |
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Post by sabongero on Jun 6, 2016 10:15:08 GMT -5
Relevant to the discussion is the use of the phrase. Originally, on the radio and in the animated shorts, Superman fought "a never-ending battle for truth and justice". The phrase would later be amended. So "the American way" was added to the radio show during the war, retired after the war and then reappeared on the TV, which debuted in 1952. Because Communism? Just a guess. Prince Hal, definitely nationalism at its core, when it was used during WWII and in the 1950's when Soviet and Chinese Communism was generating paranoia in the Western Hemisphere. I suppose "Superman Red Son" would beg to differ on that front. |
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Post by Slam_Bradley on Jun 6, 2016 10:30:41 GMT -5
Relevant to the discussion is the use of the phrase. Originally, on the radio and in the animated shorts, Superman fought "a never-ending battle for truth and justice". The phrase would later be amended. So "the American way" was added to the radio show during the war, retired after the war and then reappeared on the TV, which debuted in 1952. Because Communism? Just a guess. Yep. Some good old Red Scareanoia. |
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Post by Slam_Bradley on Jun 6, 2016 10:57:38 GMT -5
To me, the American Way implied Freedom for all and having said that the writer of the comic book is trying to embrace patriotism to all American People. The American Way can be viewed anyway you slice it and there is no wrong way of interpreting it and therefore in my own upbringing it's provokes loyalty to the American Way of Life. However, I have mixed feelings about this and even so it's stirring in it's own fashion it's can make certain groups angry to the core. And that why they drop the American Way and replace it with freedom. Freedom means a lot to people and I for one can see applied to Superman because he is their only hope for a better tomorrow. I didn't read a lot of Superman from 1990 and on because of the constant changing of the Man of Steel persona and having said that I have great difficulty of Superman once denouncing his American Citizenship and started handling things differently and that's angered a lot of readers and I can understand that. But to me, he's like a savior to all mankind and that's the beauty of Superman because he has great powers - far greater than any ordinary man and that's can be a blessing to all that received his help. In my own knowledge of Superman ... he is the Earth's Greatest Protector without Superman there is no hope and no freedom for all mankind. I know that I may sound corny to you ... but that's how I see Superman in my own understanding of all the things that he stands for. Sorry, aren't us non Americans equally free? I certainly feel free. Even my healthcare is free. In what way is the American way of life any different to the British, German, French, Belgian, Australian, Italian, Norwegian, Dutch, Irish, Spanish or Canadian way of life? American's have, rightly or wrongly, always thought they have a monopoly on freedom. There are a lot of reasons for it, dating back to the Revolution and before, but that's the way it is. However, leaving that aside...and leaving aside current Jingoism and empirical evidence that shows pretty clearly that Americans are less free at this point than a number of other citizens of the world...there are definitely reasons that the phrase was added when it was. As pointed out by Prince Hal you had the phrase come up in conjunction with World War II and The Red Scare. But if you look at immigration to the U.S. it shows a story of why the view would be in the 40s and the 50s that America was the land of freedom. Immigration into the U.S. peaked in 1907, but was very high from 1904-1914. In those years around 10 million people immigrated to America, largely from Southern and Eastern Europe, most of whom had lived very marginal lives there and many of whom (the Jewish immigrants) had been actively oppressed. Fast forward 40-50 years and the there are a ton of comic creators, television and movie writers and executives who were immigrants or first generation Americans who still see The U.S. as the place where you can come to seek freedom and opportunity. Now, in light of the treatment of blacks and other minorities in the U.S. at the time you can certainly argue that none of this was true. But comics definitely, and other media certainly, never accurately depicted reality. |
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Post by tingramretro on Jun 6, 2016 11:55:54 GMT -5
Sorry, aren't us non Americans equally free? I certainly feel free. Even my healthcare is free. In what way is the American way of life any different to the British, German, French, Belgian, Australian, Italian, Norwegian, Dutch, Irish, Spanish or Canadian way of life? American's have, rightly or wrongly, always thought they have a monopoly on freedom. There are a lot of reasons for it, dating back to the Revolution and before, but that's the way it is. However, leaving that aside...and leaving aside current Jingoism and empirical evidence that shows pretty clearly that Americans are less free at this point than a number of other citizens of the world...there are definitely reasons that the phrase was added when it was. As pointed out by Prince Hal you had the phrase come up in conjunction with World War II and The Red Scare. But if you look at immigration to the U.S. it shows a story of why the view would be in the 40s and the 50s that America was the land of freedom. Immigration into the U.S. peaked in 1907, but was very high from 1904-1914. In those years over around 10 million people immigrated to America, largely from Southern and Eastern Europe, most of whom had lived very marginal lives there and many of whom (the Jewish immigrants) had been actively oppressed. Fast forward 40-50 years and the there are a ton of comic creator's, television and movie writers and executives who were immigrants or first generation Americans who still see The U.S. as the place where you can come to seek freedom and opportunity. Now, in light of the treatment of blacks and other minorities in the U.S. at the time you can certainly argue that none of this was true. But comics definitely, and other media certainly, never accurately depicted reality. It's an attitude that tends to mildly (or more than mildly) irritate a lot of people outside the U.S. Like the phrase "leader of the free world". We c an choose leaders of our own. And to Paul Levitz, who wrote the I'm sure unintentionally offensive introductory caption in DC Special #29: I'm sorry, but World War II had indeed started by 1940, regardless of whether or not America had yet become involved. By your logic, Paulie, WWII never actually got started at all because the Swiss kept out of it! |
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Post by String on Jun 6, 2016 21:00:23 GMT -5
I'm not sure, I never really gave it much thought honestly. Yeah, it's a phrase that I've always heard growing up but simplistically, I thought it was due to Superman making his home in America even though he 'protects' the world. I guess now I would say that one precept of it is that it represents the immigration ideal, that coming to America offers you and your family the opportunity to better your life and situation. That may be somewhat naive but wouldn't Superman fight for your chance for a 'better tomorrow'?
But I think the phrase is as oddly placed as the Justice League of America even though both 'protect' the entire world.
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