shaxper
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Posts: 22,874
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Post by shaxper on Jan 8, 2018 13:32:36 GMT -5
We've heard some crazy stories about our favorite creators behind the scenes; I thought it would be interesting to try to compile them all here. Who was the most difficult to work with? Who was the most batsh*t crazy? Only two ground rules: 1. Let's not make this about attacking individuals. Stick to the facts and allegations. I'm less interested in what you think of Bob Kane and more interested in what Jerry Robinson thought of him. 2. When possible, provide sources. I'd like to minimize hearsay when possible. I'm not sure whether more serious issues (Eddie Berganza, for example) belong in this thread. I'll leave that to you to decide. Let's just maintain a positive tone and not get enmeshed in debating the politics of publishers. At the end of the day, we're all here because we love the works these people gave us, so let's make sure we keep the spirit loving, sort of a "creators say the darndest things" experience
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Post by Hoosier X on Jan 8, 2018 13:49:16 GMT -5
It's funny you should use the example of what Jerry Robinson thought of Bob Kane because I once attended a Batman panel at San Diego Comic-Con (2009, I think) where Jerry Robinson talked about this very topic! It was Sheldon Moldoff, Jerry Robinson and Lew Sayre Schwarz talking about the early days of Batman and working with Bob Kane. It was mostly Moldoff telling very funny stories about how awful Bob Kane was, with Robinson and Schwarz agreeing with him. But Jerry Robinson - a very nice, soft-spoken man who was rather reluctant to tear into Kane too harshly (he reminded me of Dick van Dyke) - did tell one story that I mostly remember.
I have a few things to do today but I should be able to get back to this maybe later today, maybe in a few days.
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Post by codystarbuck on Jan 8, 2018 14:00:23 GMT -5
Jack Kirby spoke of Victor Fox as being a rather clueless, brazen copyist and schlockmeister, putting out low grade copies of whatever was selling elsewhere. He used to go around the offices, saying, "I'm the King of Comics!" Kirby, Bill Everett and others used to make fun of him, behind his back, with the "King of Comics!" line. Later, when Stan was giving everyone at Marvel nicknames, he dubbed Kirby King and Kirby wanted nothing to do with it, telling Everett he could be King; but, it stuck and Kirby had to bear it. I believe he spoke of it in his infamous Comics Journal interview, from the early 90s, before his death.
Mike Richardson's Between the Panels has several quotes fro Gil Kane about Julie Schwartz that were less than complimentary. It seems Kane had little regard for him.
In the Kimota Companion, Chuck Austen spoke of issues with cat yronwode. Supposedly, she called him about late art, while he was out and was berating his mother, when he walked in and his mother handed him to phone. cat said she was told that he was gone and he replied he just walked in, which he said cat didn't seem to buy. She then went after him and he replied that he had Fedexed the artwork and she asked for the tracking to verify where it was. Alan Moore also spoke of problems with her and Between the Panels shares some anecdotes about her calling up Diana Schutz and telling her she slept with pigs, after someone left Eclipse to work at Comico (I think). Others speak glowingly of cat; I suspect it depended on timeframe (early Eclipse vs later) and disposition of the other person.
On the flip side, there was an account of Mark Gruenwald, when the returns on the New Universe titles came in, wadding up the covers and filling his office with them, while staffers watched the pile get higher and higher, through his office window.
Steve Engelhart, in The Comic Book Artist, spoke of being told by the new EIC that they were taking over Avengers because they wanted to write it and could do what they liked. He remarked that is was a major element in why he left for DC. In the same piece, Roy Thomas spoke of his contract renewal and some rather duplicitous statements before he submitted his contract requirements and when Jim Shooter and Marvel replied. Thomas said he warned against making Shooter EIC and that he was being proven right and reluctantly decided to talk to DC. The counter to that is that Roy basically was a law unto himself, as were others and Shooter was dealing with a chaotic line that wasn't meeting deadlines, which was affecting sales. He decided that the writer-editor contracts were working against Marvel and worked to get rid of them, when they came up. There is a case where you can see both sides of the argument, about Shooter being too dictatorial and Shooter trying to get people to act like professionals and meet deadlines.
In The Comic Book Rebels, Colleen Doran tells some horror stories of editors and publishers trying to take advantage of her, as a minor and a woman, both economically and sexually. One editor booked her into his hotel room, at a convention. She spent the night sleeping in the lobby. She accused Richard Pini of trying to steal her copyright on A Distant Soil. Doran was also one of a dozen people who sued the Donning/Starblaze company for copyright violation and fraud.
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shaxper
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Posts: 22,874
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Post by shaxper on Jan 8, 2018 14:54:57 GMT -5
On the flip side, there was an account of Mark Gruenwald, when the returns on the New Universe titles came in, wadding up the covers and filling his office with them, while staffers watched the pile get higher and higher, through his office window. Wait...what? Yes, I'd heard this one
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Crimebuster
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Making comics!
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Post by Crimebuster on Jan 8, 2018 16:40:22 GMT -5
There's an apocryphal story that a writer (supposedly Don Cameron) got so fed up with Mort Weisinger being a jerk that he dangled Weisinger out a window. It seems likely that some version of this story happened at DC, because I've seen versions of it several times, but just who was involved is a matter of debate. IN an interview, Bob Haney said he heard it was actually Bob Kanigher who was dangled out a window.
Speaking of Eddie Berganza, DC does not have a great track record with this sort of thing. Several women, including Colleen Doran, Jo Duffy, and Jill Thompson, have stated that they were harassed or assaulted by "Uncle" Julie Schwartz. These accusations were apparently well known at the time but DC did nothing and the accusations were not reported by the comics media until after his death many years later.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 8, 2018 18:21:04 GMT -5
Well. . there was that time at a mini-con function, we were out at the patio of a bar, and we watched the Writer of a bestselling Marvel book go to a potted plant and pee. directly behind the children of another comic creator (whom I won't name, tho she absolutely still remembers it too, since we just saw each other at Dragon*con for the first time in many years, and after hugging hello in artist's alley, she brought up that incident). we bonded over watching a writer pee behind her kids and, yes, the bathroom was right inside the bar. and, no, I have no idea (other than : he was very drunk) as to why he chose the corner of the patio to use instead of the bathroom. that my horror story
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Post by Deleted on Jan 8, 2018 18:22:36 GMT -5
^ unless y'all wanna hear about the time Gareb Shamus struck up a conversation with me at a urinal (um.. . equipment in hand) at the Wizard World Dallas show many years ago.
yes, it was nice he decided to ask me if i was enjoying the show. . . but yeah, the timing was a bit weird.
LOL. .that one, most of the CBR folks we met up with know about, since I came out of the restroom and immediately told them.
(and for you old timers, the reason we had gone up to Dallas..and had a mini CBR meet up at a Wizard World convention, was because koop - y'all remember him from CBR? - his business, koop's comics, was selling in the dealer's room, and he got all of us passes to get in free, in exchange for helping him out during the show. So there were at least a dozen CBR forum folks that showed up to help him out).
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Post by Reptisaurus! on Jan 8, 2018 19:15:26 GMT -5
Everybody loves Archie Goodwin. Nobody has anything less than glowing praise, ever.
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shaxper
CCF Site Custodian
Posts: 22,874
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Post by shaxper on Jan 8, 2018 21:16:33 GMT -5
^ unless y'all wanna hear about the time Gareb Shamus struck up a conversation with me at a urinal (um.. . equipment in hand) at the Wizard World Dallas show many years ago. Perhaps he was looking for an opportunity to tell you that his was polybagged, gatefold length, and came with a free trading card
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Post by Deleted on Jan 8, 2018 21:50:41 GMT -5
^ unless y'all wanna hear about the time Gareb Shamus struck up a conversation with me at a urinal (um.. . equipment in hand) at the Wizard World Dallas show many years ago. Perhaps he was looking for an opportunity to tell you that his was polybagged, gatefold length, and came with a free trading card as long as it didn't have Rob Liefeld proportions, eh?
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Post by Deleted on Jan 8, 2018 23:32:59 GMT -5
Perhaps he was looking for an opportunity to tell you that his was polybagged, gatefold length, and came with a free trading card as long as it didn't have Rob Liefeld proportions, eh? Or glow in the dark... -M
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Post by codystarbuck on Jan 9, 2018 0:43:03 GMT -5
On the flip side, there was an account of Mark Gruenwald, when the returns on the New Universe titles came in, wadding up the covers and filling his office with them, while staffers watched the pile get higher and higher, through his office window. Wait...what? Yes, I'd heard this one I believe Mike Richardson talked about it in Between the Panels. When the New Universe titles hit the stands, they did so with a thud. They got back bundle after bundle of unsold, stripped covers (returned for credit, in standard newsstand affidavit return). Gruenwald, just for fun, took the returned covers, wadded them up and tossed them on the floor. As more came in, he added them to the pile. Everyone would watch the pile grow, through his office window, until it was near the ceiling. Apparently, Gruenwald did a lot of goofy stunts like that, to boost morale. There is another story of either him or Archie Goodwin or both leaving an office by not touching the floor, climbing over furniture to move across the room. Eisner, in The Dreamer, tells the story of a mobster coming into their offices to shake them down for "towel services" for the building (providing towels for the restrooms). Eisner didn't want their towel service; but, they tried to muscle him. He says that Jack Kirby got in the guys face and ran him off, despite being shorter. Others have confirmed a version of the story. It was retold at one of the San Diego cons, when Al Feldstein (I think) was given an award. Eisner then talked about Feldstein's time there and how he started out erasing smudges from the art. Feldstein replied, "And why were there smudges? There weren't any damn towels!" Between the Panels has a lot of great material. It elaborated on the story that Mike Grell brought a gun to contract negotiations with First (Grell has spoken about it on an interview, on youtube). Grell actually had been given a .45 automatic, by his brother, for Christmas, and had it in his briefcase when he went to discuss his contract, at First's offices. The legend was that he pulled it out, laid it on the table and said, "Okay, let's negotiate!" The reality was that someone saw it, asked to take a look at it and Grell pulled it out, made sure it was clear and passed it around. Kanigher was the main one who was alleged to have been held out a window and Alex Toth is generally the person who is claimed to have done it. Toth denied the story. I think it was Grell, clarifying another story, said Denys Cowan sent a wrestler to Now Comics to collect on a bounced check. The Comics Journal had a whole article about Now's bankruptcy and charges of stolen artwork and monies owed to various people. That is an old one, really. In the Comic book Artist, Dick Giordano tells of Steve Ditko creating a rather twisted Santa story, posting a page at a time over the course of the holiday. Supposedly it was both hilarious and gruesome, each page getting wilder than the last. Another from Between the Panels: either Marie Severin or Herb Trimpe (I don't have my copy anymore), after Kirby left for DC, found a cigar butt and pinned it to a note on the wall that said, "I quit!" At a convention in Collinsville, IL, Mike Gold told me a story of how Eliott S! Maggin sucker-punched him at a convention. Gold was his editor and Maggin had stopped sending in work owed to the company. Gold said he decided that if Maggin didn't want to do the work, he didn't want to pay him anymore and told him he was fired. Gold claims that Maggin came up behind him at a convention, son after, and punched him. Gold further stated he was ready to retaliate when others got between and broke it up. If you've never met Mike Gold, he's a fairly big guy. Probably wouldn't have gone well had he been able to go back after Maggin. He didn't bear him any ill will; just said something was bothering Maggin then and he just stopped producing work. I can't remember if it was in Between the Panels or elsewhere that the story was told that Dave Sim, who was known to push people's buttons, deliberately, started getting on Jeff Smith (who has a rep as the nicest guy on the planet) about his wife and Smith had enough and almost came to blows over it.
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Post by Chris on Jan 9, 2018 1:31:29 GMT -5
^ unless y'all wanna hear about the time Gareb Shamus struck up a conversation with me at a urinal (um.. . equipment in hand) at the Wizard World Dallas show many years ago. Perhaps he was looking for an opportunity to tell you that his was polybagged, gatefold length, and came with a free trading card You win the day, sir. Wonder if it was signed and numbered by Rob Liefeld? Actually, I really don't want to wonder about that at all.
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Post by Reptisaurus! on Jan 9, 2018 7:13:30 GMT -5
Mark Waid comes out looking pretty bad in the Oral History of Fantagraphics
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Post by Icctrombone on Jan 9, 2018 7:18:15 GMT -5
^ unless y'all wanna hear about the time Gareb Shamus struck up a conversation with me at a urinal (um.. . equipment in hand) at the Wizard World Dallas show many years ago. Perhaps he was looking for an opportunity to tell you that his was polybagged, gatefold length, and came with a free trading card And yet, he made Millions and married a model. Don't you hate an unfair world ?
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