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Post by coke & comics on Feb 15, 2018 2:48:35 GMT -5
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Post by coke & comics on Feb 15, 2018 2:54:56 GMT -5
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Post by EdoBosnar on Feb 15, 2018 4:43:34 GMT -5
Love those pages, also love the T'Challa-Monica relationship.
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Post by coke & comics on Feb 19, 2018 23:59:40 GMT -5
Panther vs the Klan
Jungle Action #19-22,24
Great basis for a story, great reason to bring Black Panther to America. Phenomenal art by Graham as posted earlier. And the story has an intriguing set-up. A murder mystery. Another Klan-like group. It doesn't go far enough to say whether it's a great story as it's cut off too suddenly.
A couple of notes.
The storytelling device that transported Black Panther back to the 19th century to battle early incarnations of the Klan was quite clever, I thought.
It was weird how often Black Panther was in costume. Eating dinner with Monica's parents, grocery shopping. Did he bring no other clothes to America? There are at least comments made about him wearing it to the grocery store. But wearing it at the Lynnes was even odder. He took his mask off to eat, then immediately put it back on after clearing his plate even though they were still sitting at the table talking.
The abrupt end to this story to make way for Kirby's run is definitely a loss.
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Post by Roquefort Raider on Feb 20, 2018 6:54:18 GMT -5
The abrupt end to this story to make way for Kirby's run is definitely a loss. The Kirby run has its fans, but I fully agree... it deprived us of a great storyline, and replaced it with something that was (in my opinion) not as enjoyable. The entire world built by McGregor around T’Challa pretty much died at that point, which is a real pity.
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Post by EdoBosnar on Feb 20, 2018 7:48:10 GMT -5
Yep, I really wish McGregor, Graham & co. had been given the opportunity to continue on with Black Panther (the conclusion from Marvel Premiere #s 51-53 was really unsatisfying - although I can't completely pan it, since it prompted me, back in the day, to seek out the issues of Jungle Action cited in the editor's notes). The entire world built by McGregor around T’Challa pretty much died at that point, which is a real pity. You're probably right about that, in that it seems like pretty much every writer and editor who followed seemed to do their best to ignore McGregor's run. However, McGregor did revisit a number of the characters and story elements from his first run in the mini-series "Panther's Prey" which, naturally, also has its many detractors but which I thought was pretty good, but which was, as far as i know, ignored by all the other later Panther writers. Also, related to this topic, I was alerted to this rather infuriating tweet the other day: Thankfully, there has been some push-back, most notably by a guy named Matt Kamen, who posted a series of tweets correcting the error and explaining the respective roles of Kirby and McGregor in BP's publishing history.
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Post by berkley on Feb 20, 2018 21:45:43 GMT -5
The abrupt end to this story to make way for Kirby's run is definitely a loss. The Kirby run has its fans, but I fully agree... it deprived us of a great storyline, and replaced it with something that was (in my opinion) not as enjoyable. The entire world built by McGregor around T’Challa pretty much died at that point, which is a real pity. Yes, I'm a fan of the Kirby run too, but I agree, it was a great loss that the McGregor/Graham run was ended. There was really no reason why both series couldn't have run concurrently, which is probably what would happen under the same circumstances today. But back then it would have taken some pretty impressive outside-the-box thinking. What happened after the Kirby run ended? It was briefly taken over by someone else - I remember some nice artwork by Jerry Bingham, I think it was, can't recall much about the stories right now. Had McGregor already left Marvel by then? It's too bad they didn't hand it back over to him and Bill Graham. The latter probably doesn't get as much credit as he should: some of the best superhero artwork of its time (which means of all time, in my book) as the pages posted above amply show.
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Post by EdoBosnar on Feb 21, 2018 3:47:31 GMT -5
When Kirby left the series, Ed Hannigan took over as writer, and he basically tried to integrate the Kirby run with the McGregor/Graham material that preceded it - and he really wasn't successful in my opinion. Although to be fair, that was a (to use some florid Marvelesque vocabulary) nigh impossible task, and he was probably doing it under editorial (read Shooter's) dictate. The art in those stories, i.e., the last three issues of the Panther solo series and the three Marvel Premiere issues I mentioned above, is really very nice: all by Jerry Bingham, and all except MP #53 inked by Gene Day.
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Post by Roquefort Raider on Feb 21, 2018 6:06:08 GMT -5
EdoBosnar tells it like it is. Thise issues had Klaw in them, and Wind Eagle (from the McGregor run) makes an appearance. I think I remember Monica Lynne as well, but the momentum of McGregor’s run was gone... It was like a new Panther series with some name-dropping from the Jungle Action days, as if the writer wasn’t sure where he wanted to go from then on. Interactions between members of the cast might have become deeper later on, but the book was cancelled. Nice art, though.
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Post by Dizzy D on Feb 24, 2018 17:03:55 GMT -5
For those who are not reading modern comics, Black Panther annual #1, on sale this week, contains 3 new Black Panther stories, including a story by Don McGregor about T'Challa and Monica Lynne (it's an alternate history story, but I thought it was pretty good). I don't think this was the direction McGregor was going for at the time though, so don't see it as the missing piece of his original run.
(The other two stories are by Christopher Priest and by Reginald Hudlin, both tying into their own runs of Black Panther, though Priest's story is the only one that takes place during Coates' current run, even if it deals with characters from Priest's run.)
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Post by Reptisaurus! on Feb 24, 2018 18:00:06 GMT -5
So the internet isn't being particularly helpful for this..
I'm trying to place Fantastic Four # 52-53 in the history of AfroFuturism. It came out before Octavia E. Butler and Parliament/Funkadelic really took off (stratospheric!)
But a little after Sun Ra returned from saturn.
Still, it seems like Wakanda was really quite early in the history of literary Afrofuturism - A little later than earlier Samuel R. Delaney, but I dunno if you could label his early works AfroFuturist.
Also, did the "hidden techno jungle" thing pre-date Lee/Kirby?
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Post by berkley on Feb 26, 2018 1:46:43 GMT -5
Did the Phantom have anything like that?
You'd also think the idea might have popped up in Tarzan at some point, whether in the ERB books or the movies, but I can't say I remember anything of the sort.
Looking up Afrofuturism on wiki led me to the Black Science Fiction entry, on which I found a few books to add to my to-read list. One of them, Of One Blood, by Pauline Hopkins, is about "a hidden civilization with advanced technology in Ethiopia". I'm interested in early science fiction in general so I'm pretty excited to read it. It was published in 1902, so I should get to it in the next year or so (I'm just getting into the early 1890s right now). Looks like archive.org might have it if I can't find a printed edition.
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Post by coke & comics on Feb 26, 2018 13:19:43 GMT -5
So the internet isn't being particularly helpful for this.. I'm trying to place Fantastic Four # 52-53 in the history of AfroFuturism. It came out before Octavia E. Butler and Parliament/Funkadelic really took off (stratospheric!) But a little after Sun Ra returned from saturn. Still, it seems like Wakanda was really quite early in the history of literary Afrofuturism - A little later than earlier Samuel R. Delaney, but I dunno if you could label his early works AfroFuturist. Also, did the "hidden techno jungle" thing pre-date Lee/Kirby? I'd be curious too. I've certainly read nothing I would call afrofuturist prior to Black Panther.
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Post by coke & comics on Feb 26, 2018 13:21:35 GMT -5
Black Panther by Jack KirbyBlack Panther #1-12 And now for something completely different. Kirby showed no interest in acknowledging any prior work on the character. Though it doesn't necessarily contradict anything. But familiar faces are absent. Monica Lynne? W'Kabi? Instead, we see someone named N'Gassi as regent in T'Challa's absence. Kirby wanted to tell a sci/fi adventure story. And did. Black Panther is traveling the world in search of treasures that unlock the power of time travel, which brings him into conflict with people from the ancient past and distant future. We then visit Wakanda again, as a rogue general is staging a military coup. Which seems at first to be more familiar territory. But he quickly gets turned into a vibranium monster who Black Panther has to fight. And, of course, contact with vibranium gives Black Panther telepathic powers. As far as what Kirby was doing at the time, I prefer his work on Eternals and Devil Dinosaur. As far as Black Panther goes, I was preferring the McGregor/Graham stuff. I could perhaps see someone liking this. If you just get swept up in the batshit craziness of it all. Here's an old Brian Cronin article on Black Panther's psychic powers. www.cbr.com/the-abandoned-an-forsaked-the-black-panther-has-esp/
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Post by coke & comics on Mar 1, 2018 1:59:31 GMT -5
I should also have mentioned, as Brian Cronin observes, that in the Jack Kirby series, we learn Black Panther is a hereditary title. In his first appearance, it was strongly implied he was the first Black Panther. There was no hint his father was until now: www.cbr.com/black-panther-hereditary-title/
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