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Post by Deleted on Jun 16, 2019 12:32:52 GMT -5
Warrior (as in the wrestler) debuted a comic in 1996. I have no idea what he was trying to say in that book. I feel it should have either been action-driven and non-highbrow or someone should have edited it so that the message, whatever it was, was understandable. I am not sure why Warrior and Santa Claus had a confrontation (one example). Covers here. |
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Post by Icctrombone on Jun 27, 2019 22:12:35 GMT -5
Infinity Inc was a bit of a disappointment for me. I would buy anything that Roy Thomas would work on for a while there but this book just didn't keep my interest. I don't know if it was the bland characters or maybe Roys overexplaining type of writing finally ran its course with me.
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shaxper
CCF Site Custodian
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Post by shaxper on Jun 27, 2019 23:36:42 GMT -5
Sovereign frickin' Seven.
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Post by mikelmidnight on Jun 28, 2019 11:30:36 GMT -5
Infinity Inc was a bit of a disappointment for me. I would buy anything that Roy Thomas would work on for a while there but this book just didn't keep my interest. I don't know if it was the bland characters or maybe Roys overexplaining type of writing finally ran its course with me.
I understood his goal, to have make the E-2 Teen Titans (which they essentially were, even though they were older) distinct by not having their powers parallel the originals' too closely, but I felt in the long run it was a mistake. Aside from giving Brainwave Jr the Wood-designed costume, I never felt connected to any of the Infinitors (and thought superpowered children for Alan Scott were particularly perplexing).
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Post by codystarbuck on Jun 28, 2019 13:22:13 GMT -5
Warrior (as in the wrestler) debuted a comic in 1996. I have no idea what he was trying to say in that book. I feel it should have either been action-driven and non-highbrow or someone should have edited it so that the message, whatever it was, was understandable. I am not sure why Warrior and Santa Claus had a confrontation (one example). Covers here. What he was trying to say was that he was a complete nutjob. Seriously, the man was irrational and aggressively hateful. Jim Hellwig trademarked the name Warrior and legally changed his name to Warrior Warrior. He then spent his retirement (after making serious cash for very little work, in the ring, and not much of a box office draw) making right wing hate speeches, to crowds at university campuses (to the sounds of student protests from the other side of the spectrum) and posting videos with incoherent rants (rather like his promos). The comic came out during the late 90s wrestling boom and was a total incoherent mess, with all kinds of messed up imagery, including Santa Claus in bondage. He approved this stuff (which had some ugly art), so it was a pretty good window into his demented mind. At the same time, Chaos Comics had an Undertaker comic and there was a Chyna one. I've never heard good about either. For my money, the best use of pro wrestling in a comic is Jaime Hernadez's Whoa ,Nellie!, with Gina and Xochitl, from his last storyline, in the original Love & Rockets comic...    Aside from the main story, which revolved around the lives of Xochitl and Gina, as they deal with life, family, and trying to build their careers, it featured wrestling magazine-style pin-ups of other lady wrestlers, with old school championship belts, which really captured the look and feel of the old territorial wrestling days (Jaime grew up with the LA promotion, with guys like Roddy Piper and Kieth Franks, aka Adrian Adonis). The wrestling action was far better than anyone else (depicting actual holds, at the perfect moments) and it had a real story in it, not just an attempt to recreate an angle and match, on the comic page. |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 28, 2019 13:28:45 GMT -5
Cody, if there's ever a wrestling thread on this forum, I anticipate a great chat!  I know of the UConn speech Warrior did. He made that rather bizarre statement about "queering". But couldn't even elaborate on what he meant. I take it that was his first and last public speaking engagement? Not a single person I know understands the plot of that Warrior comic. |
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Post by codystarbuck on Jun 28, 2019 13:29:43 GMT -5
Infinity Inc was a bit of a disappointment for me. I would buy anything that Roy Thomas would work on for a while there but this book just didn't keep my interest. I don't know if it was the bland characters or maybe Roys overexplaining type of writing finally ran its course with me. It started out in an interesting manner; but, then kind of indulges Roy's love of the old All-Star issues. There were brief moments where it would try to create something new; but, then we'd spend an issue or two recapping an old JSA adventure. Interruptions by crossover events didn't help momentum, and artist changes also hurt. ordway was a nice start and Don Newton was set to take it over, when he died of a heart attack. McFarlane at least made it visually interesting and Roy seemed to have something livelier, with Helix. The character development wasn't as strong as you would expect, from Roy. I read it to the end; but, kept hoping it would get better. I'd be teased with something like the new Injustice Gang and then back to status quo. Millennium really did it no favors (or most books, for my money) and the attempts at creating new generations JSA characters, beyond the core group, really fell flat (Hourman, Dr Mid-Nite, Wildcat). It was no surprise when, after the series ended, they were offered up as cannon fodder, for Eclipso and others. |
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Post by codystarbuck on Jun 28, 2019 13:43:27 GMT -5
Cody, if there's ever a wrestling thread on this forum, I anticipate a great chat! I know of the UConn speech Warrior did. He made that rather bizarre statement about "queering". But couldn't even elaborate on what he meant. I take it that was his first and last public speaking engagement? Not a single person I know understands the plot of that Warrior comic. That was the most notorious; but, there were others and there were videos on Youtube. The WWE even put out a dvd about how messed up he was and how hard to deal with. Then, they mended fences, put out a tribute video of matches, inducted him into the joke of a Hall of Fame (Vince decides who goes in, meaning who hasn't criticized him, lately) and then he dropped dead. Yeah, doing that many steroids will do a number on you! The guy sold a ton of merchandising, which is where he made his money, because the gates were down, during his reign on top. Merchandising and foreign tours were doing better than the live shows, at that point (and PPV revenue). WCW paid him a fortune for their debacle, so Hogan could get a win over him, including putting a trap door in the ring, which was responsible for the back injury that Davey Boy Smith suffered, which pretty much ended his career (and got him fired, while in the hospital). Smith was messed up on painkillers and attempted a comeback in the WWE; but, it was short lived and he ended up, not to long after, another casualty of steroids, booze and pills. There is a website, called Wrestlecrap, that covered the comic in one of its features, on the original site. If you follow the link, it takes you to the site and the portal for the original site archives, which are completely accessible, for a donation of $14.95. Aside from the Warrior comic, it covers the dumb gimmicks, like the Red Rooster, Gobbledy Gooker, Who, the Yeti and more, plus stupid angles, bad matches and other silliness (such as bad wrestling movies from the 80s). The creator, RD Reynolds, was a manager for an indie promotion in Indianapolis, and put out a book, based on things covered on the site. he also teamed up with Bryan Alvarez, of Figure 4 Weekly and the Wrestling Observer Radio Show, on a book about the Death of WCW. I actually invited him to Barnes and Noble for a book signing (his first) with the Wrestlecrap book. Unfortunately, we had no advertising budget, so it was hard to get the word out, beyond his site. There's some entertaining stuff there, if you are interested. |
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Post by berkley on Jun 28, 2019 21:09:09 GMT -5
For my money, the best use of pro wrestling in a comic is Jaime Hernadez's Whoa ,Nellie!, with Gina and Xochitl, from his last storyline, in the original Love & Rockets comic... Aside from the main story, which revolved around the lives of Xochitl and Gina, as they deal with life, family, and trying to build their careers, it featured wrestling magazine-style pin-ups of other lady wrestlers, with old school championship belts, which really captured the look and feel of the old territorial wrestling days (Jaime grew up with the LA promotion, with guys like Roddy Piper and Kieth Franks, aka Adrian Adonis). The wrestling action was far better than anyone else (depicting actual holds, at the perfect moments) and it had a real story in it, not just an attempt to recreate an angle and match, on the comic page.
Yeah, I enjoyed that little series. If you've kept up with Love and Rockets the last few years, there is a fairly prominent recurring character who is a phys. ed. teacher that moonlights on the side as a pro wrestler. I'm behind a few issues so not sure if she is still making regular appearances. And of course wrestling references and storylines have been part of the book from the earliest years as well.
I wonder if MMA has been referenced in modern comics much? If Doug Moench were doing MoKF today, maybe he'd introduce an MMA character à la Rufus Cartwright, the pro-kickboxer from back in the day.
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Post by Deleted on Jun 28, 2019 21:52:53 GMT -5
Zan of the Wonder Twins ... the only thing that he can do is any form of water that concept did not agree with me.  
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The Captain
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Post by The Captain on Jun 29, 2019 9:53:21 GMT -5
This isn't a "classic" one, but I absolutely hated the Superior Iron Man title. After the success of Superior Spider-Man, which I thoroughly enjoyed, I decided to pick up the Iron Man title that adopted a similar concept. Unfortunately, instead of doing something creative and interesting like they did with SSM, they just made Tony Stark more of a dick than usual. That's it. More douche, same bag.
I read the first three issues and bought the fourth but never read it (it was on my pull list and I refuse to leave my LCS hanging if they ordered a book for me, and I didn't drop it until after issue two, so they were two months out on their orders at that point). Just another example of Marvel finding something that clicked and then running it into the ground, except they had nothing clever or different to do with SIM and it wound up being a waste of paper.
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Post by Roquefort Raider on Jun 29, 2019 17:42:09 GMT -5
Ajectiveless X-Men, started by Claremont and Lee, was the one for which the delivery/expectation ratio was the lowest. After the same team had pulled the X-Men from the marasmus that had been their lot for years (“the X-Men are dead”, “the X-Men are legends that can!t be seen on TV”, “the X-Men were transformed by the siege perilous” or whatever) I expected that this would be a fireworks worthy of the Claremont-Byrne heyday. But it turned out to be a wet and floppy fish, with childish stories and art that quickly degenerated into a parody of itself. And I did fall for the “buy the multiple covers” scam.  |
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Post by hondobrode on Jun 29, 2019 19:43:51 GMT -5
Agreed RR.
I bought the first maybe half dozen issues or so and couldn't believe how bad it was.
Didn't buy again until Morrison.
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Post by kirby101 on Jun 29, 2019 19:59:42 GMT -5
Then there are titles that start off strong with great art and then shift to an inferior artist that doesn't work at all for the book.
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Post by hondobrode on Jun 30, 2019 9:42:11 GMT -5
Sadly, I think that's the business model most editors follow.
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