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Post by rberman on Feb 19, 2020 14:08:52 GMT -5
I didn't realize that Colossus' death was so, er, short-lived. The Legacy Virus killed him in Uncanny X-Men #390 (2001) but then he returned with Joss Whedon's Astonishing X-Men #4 (2004).  |
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Post by beccabear67 on Feb 19, 2020 15:43:09 GMT -5
It might be easier to try and keep track of what characters they haven't killed. So far I've stayed away from the Claremont return to Uncanny and X-Men (#s 381 & 100 respectively), and anything from that month onward X related I am not knowing, even Gen X or X-Force.
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Post by Roquefort Raider on Feb 19, 2020 16:46:27 GMT -5
I didn't realize that Colossus' death was so, er, short-lived. The Legacy Virus killed him in Uncanny X-Men #390 (2001) but then he returned with Joss Whedon's Astonishing X-Men #4 (2004). Same here. But then I read that after it had been collected, so more time had elapsed. Time is sort of fluid, too, when it comes to comics. Jean Grey stayed dead longer (after the Morrison era) than she did after X-Men #137. |
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Post by profh0011 on Feb 19, 2020 22:27:35 GMT -5
"Was the 1990s really bad?"
YES.
But, with exceptions.
I stopped buying ALL Marvels for quite a few years. I never expected to buy ANY new Marvels ever again, and I might never have, if my best friend hadn't told me what Roger Stern was up to. Of course, that didn't last.
Over at DC, things were more interesting. I'd TOTALLY given up on BATMAN... and then, some years later, SUPERMAN. But oddly enough, the formerly-"Earth-2" characters had some of their best runs EVER.
SANDMAN MYSTERY THEATRE (new stories about the Golden Age Sandman)
THE SPECTRE (John Ostrander tied together all the various runs and did a long run of stories that gave "closure" the Jim Corrigan, the way Andy Helfer & Gerard Jones had HOPED to do with Hal Jordan before their plans were TOTALLY SABOTAGED by an incompetent ego-maniac editor who's NOT IN COMICS anymore)
STARMAN (a brand-new version of the character replacing the previous brand-new version of the character, and one tied in directly to the original, arguably the best run of any character with the name)
STARS AND S.T.R.I.P.E. (a modern follow-up to Star-Spangled Kid, for God's sake!! --and one of the most FUN books of the era)
In addition to these... there was a PILE of creator-owned series from "independant" publishers as good or better than what DC was doing, but of course, nowhere near as high-profile.
NEXUS
MADMAN
GROO THE WANDERER
I'd have to thumb thru my collection to jar my memory further...
It just always-- and increasingly-- makes me shake my head in dismay when I hear anybody still going on about current Marvel & DC super-heroes. I just told my best friend again yesterday... I STILL love super-heroes. But I have HAD IT-- FOREVER-- with anything new from "the big two". I was happy it made him laugh when I added... "They've BURNED THEIR BRIDGES." The old books will always be there to enjoy anew!
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Post by tartanphantom on Feb 20, 2020 14:55:01 GMT -5
"Was the 1990s really bad?"
YES. But, with exceptions. I stopped buying ALL Marvels for quite a few years. I never expected to buy ANY new Marvels ever again, and I might never have, if my best friend hadn't told me what Roger Stern was up to. Of course, that didn't last. Over at DC, things were more interesting. I'd TOTALLY given up on BATMAN... and then, some years later, SUPERMAN. But oddly enough, the formerly-"Earth-2" characters had some of their best runs EVER. SANDMAN MYSTERY THEATRE (new stories about the Golden Age Sandman) THE SPECTRE (John Ostrander tied together all the various runs and did a long run of stories that gave "closure" the Jim Corrigan, the way Andy Helfer & Gerard Jones had HOPED to do with Hal Jordan before their plans were TOTALLY SABOTAGED by an incompetent ego-maniac editor who's NOT IN COMICS anymore) STARMAN (a brand-new version of the character replacing the previous brand-new version of the character, and one tied in directly to the original, arguably the best run of any character with the name) STARS AND S.T.R.I.P.E. (a modern follow-up to Star-Spangled Kid, for God's sake!! --and one of the most FUN books of the era) In addition to these... there was a PILE of creator-owned series from "independant" publishers as good or better than what DC was doing, but of course, nowhere near as high-profile. NEXUS
MADMAN
GROO THE WANDERERI'd have to thumb thru my collection to jar my memory further... It just always-- and increasingly-- makes me shake my head in dismay when I hear anybody still going on about current Marvel & DC super-heroes. I just told my best friend again yesterday... I STILL love super-heroes. But I have HAD IT-- FOREVER-- with anything new from "the big two". I was happy it made him laugh when I added... " They've BURNED THEIR BRIDGES." The old books will always be there to enjoy anew! Sounds like your thoughts mirror mine to a large extent. Truthfully, Robinson's Starman is sublime and enjoyable from the first issue to the very end. Another series which was a holdover from the late 80's but continued in some form well into the mid-90's was the Xenozoic Tales/Cadillacs and Dinosaurs franchise. Even the Topps-published run isn't all bad, though it pales in comparison to Mark Schultz' original story run. By the time Topps got hold of it, the mature audience overtones had been mostly abandoned in favor of a more merchandising-friendly kid-friendly approach. I just wish that Schultz had maintained an interest in writing the series... Instead of going off to do other things. |
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Post by Reptisaurus! on Feb 20, 2020 15:57:50 GMT -5
Posts like this always make me want to try to read Starman again because while I thought it was really, really bad - by far the least enjoyment I have ever had reading a mainstream comic - it wasn't really, really bad in an interesting enough way that I had any critical engagament with it. (I think it's mostly my nostalgia=the devil attitude towards comics.)
So now I just remember trying to read it a couple times and absolutely hating it, on an epic level, like maybe a 2 out of 100.
And you guys make me want to try again, which I know will just end it tears.
(I still think DC Comics, as a whole, peaked in the '90s though!)
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Post by tartanphantom on Feb 20, 2020 16:47:04 GMT -5
(I think it's mostly my nostalgia=the devil attitude towards comics.) If this is a core tenet of your comics criteria, then there's probably no way that you'll ever enjoy Robinson's Starman in any way, no matter how much you try to read it. When the central character is a dealer of "retro" pop culture antiques, that's just a foreshadowing of how Robinson treats the series as a whole. But hey, at least you recognize the likely reason for your dislike of the series. We all have our own standards of enjoyment in the comics realm. For example, I can't stand anything Ninja Turtle... But that doesn't mean that it won't strike a resonant chord with someone else. |
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Post by Icctrombone on Feb 20, 2020 18:06:50 GMT -5
Posts like this always make me want to try to read Starman again because while I thought it was really, really bad - by far the least enjoyment I have ever had reading a mainstream comic - it wasn't really, really bad in an interesting enough way that I had any critical engagament with it. (I think it's mostly my nostalgia=the devil attitude towards comics.) So now I just remember trying to read it a couple times and absolutely hating it, on an epic level, like maybe a 2 out of 100. And you guys make me want to try again, which I know will just end it tears. (I still think DC Comics, as a whole, peaked in the '90s though!) I'm not sure how to interpret this post. Is it hyperbole , or did you really mean that it's the worst mainstream comic you ever read? I have the entire run and the issues that I have read are solid and very enjoyable. I refuse to believe that you had less enjoyment reading this than reading Rom, Dazzler, Avengers the Crossing or the mountainous amount of reallybterrible comics that have been released since the 30's. |
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Post by rberman on Feb 20, 2020 18:21:14 GMT -5
Why would ROM be invoked as unenjoyable? It's a good "Silver Surfer vs the Body Snatchers" pastiche.
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Post by berkley on Feb 20, 2020 18:53:43 GMT -5
Why would ROM be invoked as unenjoyable? It's a good "Silver Surfer vs the Body Snatchers" pastiche. I can tell you probably the main reason I never gave the series a try, apart from it falling into an era when I felt out of tune with Marvel's stuff in a general way: the character design never appealed to me on an aesthetic level. I just didn't like the look of the title character that much and the covers never seemed to catch my eye or spark any interest, even though I was usually drawn to anything with a science fiction vibe. |
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Post by profh0011 on Feb 20, 2020 18:56:48 GMT -5
A few more...
USAGI YOJIMBO by Stan Sakai (I'm amazed how consistently good his writing is)
GUNSMITH CATS by Kenichi Sonada
RASCALS IN PARADISE by Jim Silkie (only a mini-series, but so damned good)
BIG BANG COMICS by Gary Carlson & an army of various writers & artists!
STRANGERS IN PARADISE by Terry Moore
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Post by tartanphantom on Feb 20, 2020 21:45:46 GMT -5
Posts like this always make me want to try to read Starman again because while I thought it was really, really bad - by far the least enjoyment I have ever had reading a mainstream comic - it wasn't really, really bad in an interesting enough way that I had any critical engagament with it. (I think it's mostly my nostalgia=the devil attitude towards comics.) So now I just remember trying to read it a couple times and absolutely hating it, on an epic level, like maybe a 2 out of 100. And you guys make me want to try again, which I know will just end it tears. (I still think DC Comics, as a whole, peaked in the '90s though!) I'm not sure how to interpret this post. Is it hyperbole , or did you really mean that it's the worst mainstream comic you ever read? I have the entire run and the issues that I have read are solid and very enjoyable. I refuse to believe that you had less enjoyment reading this than reading Rom, Dazzler, Avengers the Crossing or the mountainous amount of reallybterrible comics that have been released since the 30's.
Actually, Team America wasn't that bad... I've read much worse-- and it even had a convoluted Marvel Universe tie-in via Captain America and Hydra.
Of course DC was not totally devoid of stinkers either-- Thriller started out pretty good, but fell to pieces after Trevor Von Eeden left. and who remembers the crazy DC Challenge series? But I digress--- most of these books were 80's material, not 90's.
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Post by rberman on Feb 20, 2020 23:05:27 GMT -5
Why would ROM be invoked as unenjoyable? It's a good "Silver Surfer vs the Body Snatchers" pastiche. I can tell you probably the main reason I never gave the series a try, apart from it falling into an era when I felt out of tune with Marvel's stuff in a general way: the character design never appealed to me on an aesthetic level. I just didn't like the look of the title character that much and the covers never seemed to catch my eye or spark any interest, even though I was usually drawn to anything with a science fiction vibe. Michael Golden did a run of exceptional covers early on. Then a couple of Frank Miller. But then came three years worth of middling covers, mostly by Al Milgrom, before Bill Sienkiewicz entered the picture to liven things up, as usual for him.    |
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Post by Reptisaurus! on Feb 21, 2020 0:28:26 GMT -5
I always enjoyed Rom, although I haven't read that much of it. And I'm not being hyperbolic. There are indy comics I've liked less ( Ted Rall!!!) I do not remember ever disliking reading a mainstream comic as much as I disliked Starman, the three times I read it. It might have especially stuck in my craw 'cause I thought it was a follow-up to The Golden Age, which I really enjoyed. But I don't think I ever made it past issue 20 or so. It mighta got better. It's a little sad that Starman is limiting me to 99 read out of a hundred. |
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Post by beccabear67 on Feb 21, 2020 1:25:13 GMT -5
I just didn't like the look of the title character that much No warm feelings for vintage Sunbeam toasters?   |
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