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Post by codystarbuck on Dec 7, 2022 0:58:54 GMT -5
A lot of comic artists struggled with children, due to the proportions. Superhero proportions were exaggerated above the norm, with the head serving as the unit of measure. Usually, a human body is proportioned at about 7 1/2 heads from top of the head to the feet. With superheroes it was usually 8 heads (sometimes 9). With children, it gets a little wonky and they often end up looking like "midgets". Byrne's were pretty bad, but many of his contemporaries were not much better. June Bridgeman, of Power Pack fame, was often praised for her ability to draw real children.
Perez could never draw realistic firearms, apart from a generic revolver, and several artists had similar problems, when working on war comics (and that fan base could spot it in a heartbeat). He also struggled with certain bodytypes, at times. His Superman was a bit lean, compared to just about everyone else. He also tended to over-complicate machinery and technology, even for simple things. It looked good as background detail; but didn't always work in the foreground.
A lot of guys couldn't draw horses and more than a few could not draw recognizable car models. Fashion eluded quite a few and they would draw the same generic suits and dresses. A lot of late 80s and 90s artists couldn't draw civilian clothing, especially pants, without muscles bulging. A suit isn't cut that way and they could not do it properly. They also tended to get folds in clothing wrong.
Almost no one in the 80s could draw realistic camouflage patterns, on military uniforms and Army soldiers were still being drawn in olive drab, into the 90s, when the Woodland Camo utilities had replaced them, in the early 80s. Even Hollywood got that part right.
Some guys drew ugly or very masculine women. I have commented on Luke McDonnell's women, in my Suicide Squad review thread. They tended to look rather "butch."
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Post by Cei-U! on Dec 7, 2022 5:51:02 GMT -5
I love Jim Aparo but his women all looked like drag queens.
Cei-U! Not that there's anything wrong with that!
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Post by Slam_Bradley on Dec 7, 2022 10:11:57 GMT -5
I've just discovered that Terry Beatty couldn't draw a baby to save his life. Byrne is infamous for drawing grotesque children. Can anyone think of other examples of artists struggling to draw a particular thing?
I remember Charles* Schulz saying the reason he dropped the idea of a pet cat that he briefly introduced to the Charlie Brown household was that he soon discovered that he couldn't draw cats.
*edited to change "Charlie" to Charles Schulz: no idea how I made that mistake, unless I thought I was typing "Charlie Brown", but it was striking how wrong it looked and felt when I noticed it a few hours later.
Just use Chuck for both.
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Post by codystarbuck on Dec 7, 2022 12:01:22 GMT -5
I remember Charles* Schulz saying the reason he dropped the idea of a pet cat that he briefly introduced to the Charlie Brown household was that he soon discovered that he couldn't draw cats.
*edited to change "Charlie" to Charles Schulz: no idea how I made that mistake, unless I thought I was typing "Charlie Brown", but it was striking how wrong it looked and felt when I noticed it a few hours later.
Just use Chuck for both. Or Sparky, for the creator.
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Post by adamwarlock2099 on Dec 7, 2022 12:20:03 GMT -5
on Byrne I'm the opposite of AdamWarlock2000: love the artwork (up to the early 1980s, at least) but can't stand him as a writer. Of what I have read that he wrote I was pretty indifferent to it. I honestly think, outside of the few Terrax issues in FF the only thing of his I have read more than once was She-Hulk. And I have never actively sought out something he wrote, but also have never passed on anything I was interested in because he wrote it. Its like me with frozen yogurt over ice cream. If someone hands me ice cream I will eat and enjoy it, but mostly only ever buy frozen yogurt for myself.
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Post by MDG on Dec 7, 2022 14:47:53 GMT -5
I love Jim Aparo but his women all looked like drag queens. Cei-U! Not that there's anything wrong with that! I always thought Trina Robbins' male characters looked like women with fake mustaches pasted on.
I'm not a big fan of Steranko, but I was at a convention in 75 or so when he made a point of saying something like, "a lot of people that want to go into comics don;t realize that in comics, you have to be able to draw everything: cars, buildings, horses, machines--anything in the script. And you better be ready to do that.
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Confessor
CCF Mod Squad
Not Bucky O'Hare!
Posts: 9,614
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Post by Confessor on Dec 7, 2022 20:56:10 GMT -5
I really like John Byrne's work from the 80s. It looks great and always gives me that nostalgic feeling; his art in a comic just takes me straight back to the early 80s. Jack Kirby's women always looked like drag queens to me.
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Post by Prince Hal on Dec 7, 2022 23:03:31 GMT -5
I love Jim Aparo but his women all looked like drag queens. Cei-U! Not that there's anything wrong with that! MWGallaher just sobbed.
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Post by tonebone on Dec 9, 2022 9:46:29 GMT -5
A lot of comic artists struggled with children, due to the proportions. Superhero proportions were exaggerated above the norm, with the head serving as the unit of measure. Usually, a human body is proportioned at about 7 1/2 heads from top of the head to the feet. With superheroes it was usually 8 heads (sometimes 9). With children, it gets a little wonky and they often end up looking like "midgets". Byrne's were pretty bad, but many of his contemporaries were not much better. June Bridgeman, of Power Pack fame, was often praised for her ability to draw real children. Perez could never draw realistic firearms, apart from a generic revolver, and several artists had similar problems, when working on war comics (and that fan base could spot it in a heartbeat). He also struggled with certain bodytypes, at times. His Superman was a bit lean, compared to just about everyone else. He also tended to over-complicate machinery and technology, even for simple things. It looked good as background detail; but didn't always work in the foreground. A lot of guys couldn't draw horses and more than a few could not draw recognizable car models. Fashion eluded quite a few and they would draw the same generic suits and dresses. A lot of late 80s and 90s artists couldn't draw civilian clothing, especially pants, without muscles bulging. A suit isn't cut that way and they could not do it properly. They also tended to get folds in clothing wrong. Almost no one in the 80s could draw realistic camouflage patterns, on military uniforms and Army soldiers were still being drawn in olive drab, into the 90s, when the Woodland Camo utilities had replaced them, in the early 80s. Even Hollywood got that part right. Some guys drew ugly or very masculine women. I have commented on Luke McDonnell's women, in my Suicide Squad review thread. They tended to look rather "butch." I had 5 semesters of figure drawing in art school, and remember BEGGING my instructor at one point, to have the model wear clothing, because I could draw a naked woman like a champ, but couldn't draw pants to save my life. He was appalled. No pants.
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Post by tonebone on Dec 9, 2022 9:49:14 GMT -5
I've just discovered that Terry Beatty couldn't draw a baby to save his life. Byrne is infamous for drawing grotesque children. Can anyone think of other examples of artists struggling to draw a particular thing? I remember Charles* Schulz saying the reason he dropped the idea of a pet cat that he briefly introduced to the Charlie Brown household was that he soon discovered that he couldn't draw cats. *edited to change "Charlie" to Charles Schulz: no idea how I made that mistake, unless I thought I was typing "Charlie Brown", but it was striking how wrong it looked and felt when I noticed it a few hours later.
If you've never read that biography of Schulz from a few years back... it's fascinating. Best bio I've ever read. Actually, this one is great, also!
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Post by commond on Feb 4, 2023 5:29:16 GMT -5
What do Archie fans think of Afterlife with Archie? I think it's brilliant, but I was wondering what true Archie fans make of it. And on a similar note, are there any other series like it?
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Post by tonebone on Feb 10, 2023 9:28:24 GMT -5
I love Jim Aparo but his women all looked like drag queens. Cei-U! Not that there's anything wrong with that! I always thought Trina Robbins' male characters looked like women with fake mustaches pasted on.
I'm not a big fan of Steranko, but I was at a convention in 75 or so when he made a point of saying something like, "a lot of people that want to go into comics don;t realize that in comics, you have to be able to draw everything: cars, buildings, horses, machines--anything in the script. And you better be ready to do that.
I think that's why people like Adams, Giordano, etc. stand out. Their background in commercial illustration trained them to seek out reference for EVERYTHING in their images. He's holding a gun? WHAT KIND of gun? He's not driving a "car", he's driving a 1973 Corvette. A funny aside... In college, I used to do caricatures, for trade shows, company picnics, etc. So it would be me and about 5 other guys, under a tent or something, with a line of about 300 people lined up for their free caricature. We used to laugh after a long day of this, about what was the weirdest thing you had to draw that day, purely from memory, at the victim's request. I remember drawing a bulldog, a jeep, pigs, a grand piano, a goose, an F-15, etc. Everyone knows what they look like, but do you REALLY know what they REALLY look like, enough to draw them in less than 10 minutes? I totally butchered that grand piano, by the way.
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Post by tonebone on Feb 10, 2023 9:37:21 GMT -5
What do Archie fans think of Afterlife with Archie? I think it's brilliant, but I was wondering what true Archie fans make of it. And on a similar note, are there any other series like it? I LOVED Afterlife with Archie... the concept is pure brilliance. No character-building needed, since most of the characters have been around for 60 or more years. You already know who they are, how they act, their relationships, etc. It may sound like a recipe for boredom, but you can also use that memetic knowledge to flip the script and have them act DIFFERENTLY than you expect, which is refreshing. The year it came out, I thought it was the best comic of the year, hands down. I was disappointed that Riverdale went a... er... different route, and totally squandered the "I know these guys, already" thing by just having them all act however it suited the "plot". Archie did several other series (some of which may still be going on), including the Chilling Adventures of Sabrina (the basis for the tv show), Jughead the Hunger (he's a werewolf, Betty's a monster hunter), Vampironica (needs no explanation). There may be others. I have read Sabrina, which is great (great art by Robert Hack), and Jughead the Hunger, which is great at first, but wears thin pretty quickly, in my opinion.
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Post by MDG on Feb 10, 2023 9:53:34 GMT -5
I always thought Trina Robbins' male characters looked like women with fake mustaches pasted on.
I'm not a big fan of Steranko, but I was at a convention in 75 or so when he made a point of saying something like, "a lot of people that want to go into comics don;t realize that in comics, you have to be able to draw everything: cars, buildings, horses, machines--anything in the script. And you better be ready to do that.
I think that's why people like Adams, Giordano, etc. stand out. Their background in commercial illustration trained them to seek out reference for EVERYTHING in their images. He's holding a gun? WHAT KIND of gun? He's not driving a "car", he's driving a 1973 Corvette. One of the things that I hated about what became "the Image style" was that there seemed to be no attempt at even a nod toward realism. Things like buildings, trucks, or trees were just symbols standing in for the real thing, even more than in Archie style.
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Post by commond on Mar 14, 2023 19:01:32 GMT -5
Do you guys think Marvel's Epic line lived up to its potential?
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