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Post by crazyoldhermit on Jan 21, 2015 0:15:25 GMT -5
So, the new "Secret Wars" event is going to fuse the Marvel Universe and the Ultimate one. Nothing will ever be the same again, deep-lasting changes, significant story blah blah blah. Considering that the Ultimate universe has nothing to contribute to this fusion apart from Miles Morales and the actual Samuel Jackson Nick Fury, I don't quite see how this is going to play out. It's not as if there was a lot of continuity-fixing made possible by the idea. It's going to fuse all of their Universes. Or rather, it's going to mix them all up and pick the best parts to make their brand new continuity. Count on not just Miles Morales and the Sam J Nick Fury being in 616 but Ultimate and movie-inspired backstories for all of the characters. Yay!
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Post by Jasoomian on Jan 21, 2015 3:42:52 GMT -5
I wonder what they will do with X-Men and Fantastic Four, since they don't own those properties. Hopefully they each get their own pocket universe. I'd prefer that for the X-Men.
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Post by Nowhere Man on Jan 21, 2015 4:06:42 GMT -5
I find I like Marvel's Terrible Trio (Bendis, Hickman, Remender) much better when they are doing creator-owned stuff-Bendis'-Torso, Fire, Powers, United States of Murder Inc. etc. are great books, Remender's Fear Agents and Strange Girl are wonderful, and Hickman's Secret and Nightly News were good reads, but only Bendis has produced anything I remotely liked while working for Marvel (his DD and Ult. Spidey runs are decent). -M That's exactly how I feel. The trouble started when Quesada got it into his head that the "best" and most "innovative" inde-writers would necessarily be the best fit for mainstream superhero comics. I think Alan Moore is the best writer ever to grace comics, but I have zero faith that he could do an extended run on Fantastic Four or Thor and it be as good as Byrne's and Simonson's without completely changing the concept (like Swamp Thing) or doing a deconstruction (not really what I'm looking for in a mainstream book). The only viable talents, from my perspectives, and in terms of Marvel and DC, are writers like Mark Waid and Kurt Busiek. I've enjoyed virtually everything they've done at Marvel and DC and have always felt that their work was a perfect balance of the old and the new.
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Post by Nowhere Man on Jan 21, 2015 4:10:29 GMT -5
My hope with the new Marvel Universe is that Disney has a hand in it (Can't believe I just said that!) and that they're guiding publishing into a more all-ages direction. Basically I want a modernized version of the Bronze Age in terms of Marvel and I'm unashamed to admit it. (That said, you better leave the creator owned stuff I like alone, Bronze Age Restoration Society!)
I also want an Uncle Scrooge and Iron Man mini-series.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 21, 2015 7:00:50 GMT -5
Because: Hickman. yyyyuuuucccckkkk. Hickman only wrote the first 6 issues... It's okay, I didn't read it.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 21, 2015 13:46:10 GMT -5
My hope with the new Marvel Universe is that Disney has a hand in it (Can't believe I just said that!) and that they're guiding publishing into a more all-ages direction. Basically I want a modernized version of the Bronze Age in terms of Marvel and I'm unashamed to admit it. (That said, you better leave the creator owned stuff I like alone, Bronze Age Restoration Society!) I also want an Uncle Scrooge and Iron Man mini-series. This is actually not a bad idea or thing to want at all! I just do not know if I fully understand what they are going to be doing with this Secret Wars. Are they wiping out ALLLL the characters and just keeping the names (similar to what DC did)?? Or are they just picking certain characters who "survive" and redoing their entire history? Do I even care? I don't know.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 21, 2015 15:51:40 GMT -5
I definitely don't care what the plan is with Secret Wars. These MAJOR EVENTS always lead to me quitting reading comics for awhile.
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Post by hondobrode on Jan 21, 2015 15:57:58 GMT -5
Milestone Media 2.0 Milestone's coming back and on their own !
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Post by Deleted on Jan 21, 2015 16:23:20 GMT -5
I definitely don't care what the plan is with Secret Wars. These MAJOR EVENTS always lead to me quitting reading comics for awhile. I care ONLY to the extent of if my favorite Marvel characters disappear or not. They've already killed off Namor and a lot of their MAJOR characters, so! I guess my only other interest is to see if they keep the X-Men around, you know, AS the X-Men.
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Post by earl on Jan 21, 2015 18:59:03 GMT -5
I got to say I have kinda dug Hickman's "East of West". The artwork isn't crazy detailed and it is fairly stylized with a bit of a manga influence. It reminds me a bit of Matt Wagner's old 80s Comico style. The thing I think the artist is pretty good with is facial expressions and the character design. I think the coloring on East of West has been pretty top notch. This comic has been the most fully developed world that Hickman has put together from the comics I have read written by them. The early issues are pretty much a single issue introducing the various factions involved, but I thought #14 had some really good action. The stage is set and it's starting to go down. It is on my pull list.
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Post by crazyoldhermit on Jan 21, 2015 19:39:21 GMT -5
I definitely don't care what the plan is with Secret Wars. These MAJOR EVENTS always lead to me quitting reading comics for awhile. I care ONLY to the extent of if my favorite Marvel characters disappear or not. They've already killed off Namor and a lot of their MAJOR characters, so! I guess my only other interest is to see if they keep the X-Men around, you know, AS the X-Men. If the X-Men were gonna get dumped they would have done it already. The X-Franchise accounts for too much of Marvel's publishing revenue. What I believe we will see is the same thing we got with Crisis back in 1986: Details change, backstories are altered and there are some major overhaulings to lesser characters but we'll still have all of the characters. At this point Marvel history has gone more or less unaltered since 1961. There were a few hazy years in the 90s but even the One More Day retcon just changed one minor detail in Spider-Man's history, with the same stories all having happened. This is the first time Marvel is opening themselves up to getting rid of most or all of it, including the niggling little things that have been shaky for years. These are my guesses for some of the changes they'll make. 1) World War II/Vietnam/Gulf War/War on Terror are mostly replaced with fictional conflicts so Iron Man, The Punisher, Flash Thompson and other characters tied to real life events no longer have to play catchup. 2) Radiation-based origins are traded in for genetic engineering and other, more modern sciences. This is something the Ultimate line used for Spider-Man and Hulk (and possibly others) and I think this will be one of the major ideas brought over from the Ultimate Universe 3) Cold War themes and characters will be removed on the basis of being beyond obsolete. From 1961 to 1989 there was a lot of Cold War gunk built up that can finally be cleared out. 4) The Avengers were founded by Nick Fury/SHIELD. Again running along with the movies and the Ultimate Universe. If Marvel were really brave they would start over completely, right from the beginning with Peter being bitten by the spider, Banner getting irradiated, Cap being unfrozen, etc. Completely rebooting an entire superhero line and starting from square one has never been done. All three of DC's reboots have been partial, while The Ultimate line was very small in scale and was done with the intent of being subversive and modern. A company wide wiping of the slate and start from scratch is unheard of and would be an incredibly bold move providing the most perfect jumping on point possible (I can't think that theres no one at Disney who doesn't think this would help close the gap between comic sales and movie revenue).
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Post by Nowhere Man on Jan 21, 2015 20:28:34 GMT -5
My hope with the new Marvel Universe is that Disney has a hand in it (Can't believe I just said that!) and that they're guiding publishing into a more all-ages direction. Basically I want a modernized version of the Bronze Age in terms of Marvel and I'm unashamed to admit it. (That said, you better leave the creator owned stuff I like alone, Bronze Age Restoration Society!) I also want an Uncle Scrooge and Iron Man mini-series. This is actually not a bad idea or thing to want at all! I just do not know if I fully understand what they are going to be doing with this Secret Wars. Are they wiping out ALLLL the characters and just keeping the names (similar to what DC did)?? Or are they just picking certain characters who "survive" and redoing their entire history? Do I even care? I don't know. I think we all care to an extent, of course I'm not the target audience that will buy events or support their publishing strategies. The bigger issue for me, beyond continuity changes, is the way they've been creating comics the last decade or so. The decompressed storytelling has basically made individual issues far too expensive for what you actually get. A comic that maybe takes 10 minutes to read at 3.99 or 4.99 is ridiculous. It's clear that the main reason they're doing this is because sales are down. It hasn't seemed to sink in that short term fixes (events that boost sales) and the creative mentality that's currently in vogue isn't setting the world on fire. I'm hoping Marvel is moving to the mindset that digital comics can be the new spinner-rack and that moving towards a more all-ages approach is key for long-term survival. That is if Disney actually cares about their publishing division. Who knows? As far as continuity goes, I'm not opposed to a reboot, but the creative teams will have to interest me before I really care about the new series. I'm not a fan of Bendis, Hickman, or Remender and their drawn out, rather boring, method of writing and have little to no interest in anything written buy them unless someone like Alan Davis or Walt Simonson is doing an extended run on art duties.
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Post by Randle-El on Jan 21, 2015 21:40:16 GMT -5
The problem with true a line-wide "hard reset" that starts everyone at square one is that it prevents them from being able to use their full roster of characters, particularly ones that tied to having an established history. I think one of the main reasons why the new 52 didn't completely reset everything is because they would have gotten rid of a long list of characters that are too important to their line. Just using Batman as an example -- if Batman were starting at year one again, then there's no Robin, no Nightwing, no Batgirl, Batwoman, Batwing, etc. etc.
I think Secret Wars is Marvel's way of having their cake and eating it too as far as rebooting. For years, they've said that their continuity doesn't need fixing and have taken thinly veiled jabs at DC for their periodic reboots. And they aren't entirely incorrect, insofar that their long-standing history is one of the things that sets them apart from DC. On the other hand, they've had a taste of the reboot Kool-Aid through their increasingly frequent relaunches, and they know that things like this generate sales. I think they also recognize that, attachment to history notwithstanding, there are plenty of messy corners in the Marvel U and a reboot would a perfect opportunity to clean those up without being accused of massive retcons.
So Secret Wars is their solution. Since it will likely preserve certain definitive, character-defining moments, they can market it as not being a true reboot, but rather a cherry-picking from the best of Marvel and Ultimate Marvel continuities. On the other hand, it lets them introduce a ton of changes that are effective retcons, but technically aren't because this is a new universe. And there's no reason to keep Ultimate Marvel around anymore since a reboot of the main Marvel U negates the reason for having a separate Ultimate Marvel line in the first place.
The thing I find to be amusing about all this is that DC's Convergence seems to be doing something pretty similar, in that they've strongly hinted at pre-new 52 characters and concepts returning to their publishing line post-Convergence, and at nearly the same time as Marvel. The big two have copied ideas from each other in the past, but this is seriously on a new level.
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Post by Deleted on Jan 22, 2015 1:30:55 GMT -5
Milestone Media 2.0 Milestone's coming back and on their own ! I love this image. It's totally 80's
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Post by hondobrode on Jan 22, 2015 2:36:47 GMT -5
Correct.
That's Bill Sienkiewicz art.
I don't think any other artist empitomizes the 80's cover art more than Sienkiewicz.
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