Roquefort Raider
CCF Mod Squad
Modus omnibus in rebus
Posts: 17,420 
Member is Online
|
Post by Roquefort Raider on Jan 22, 2015 14:36:11 GMT -5
Remember, when the Ultimate Universe came out, there were big rumors that the Main MU was done for... they didn't end up pulling the trigger. This time I think they do. I hope it won't be the case. Since Axel Alonso says things like "our continuity is not broken" at the same time as he says "the Marvel Universe is ending", I kind of expect to see a slightly rebooted MU. One in which everything is pretty much the same, except that Captain America stayed frozen until 2005, Tony Stark was hurt in Afghanistan, Peter Parker got bitten by a spider 5 years ago and the like. Just the kind of things that do not require a reboot; writers could simply not keep referring to past events so much. (I mean, even in 1975 it made no sense for Reed and Ben to have served during WWII; it wasn't a big deal then, and it doesn't need to be a big deal now. If you write a modern FF story, you just don't mention those past references). |
|
|
|
Post by Dizzy D on Jan 22, 2015 14:44:26 GMT -5
Having just read the preview for the new Uncanny Avengers #1… There's a new Counter-Earth, now? Not that I mind as I always liked the concept, but I thought the Beyonders had moved it away in the 80s (and a quick look on Wikipedia tells me it was destroyed by Thanos, then replaced by a new one, which was also destroyed by Thanos). Also, I hate the retcon of a retcon of a retcon that now makes Pietro and Wanda not being Magneto's children, and perhaps not even mutants. Odd that Wanda looks so much like Magda, Magneto's deceased wife… Odd that all the sentinels who met the pair over the years marked them as mutants… Odd that Pietro's and Magneto's hairline looks so similar (and that they both had prematurely white hair). Odd that Pietro was depowered by a spell that targeted mutants during M-Day, and that Cerebro can find them. Odd that I waste time over the concept that modern and supposedly .serious" comic-books should make sense!  There have been several by then even. The latest one I remember was the Heroes Reborn world (this was near the end of volume 1 of Thunderbolts). And I always found it odd that the retconned the Whizzer into not being their father. Really, a superspeedster's wife gives birth in the same exact place at the exact time as another woman and one of the children of the other woman has superspeed powers? (And didn't the Whizzer also have white hair or is that only the Squadron Supreme one? And Wanda's hair looks pretty similar to Miss America's.) |
|
Roquefort Raider
CCF Mod Squad
Modus omnibus in rebus
Posts: 17,420
Member is Online
|
Post by Roquefort Raider on Jan 22, 2015 14:47:37 GMT -5
Having just read the preview for the new Uncanny Avengers #1… There's a new Counter-Earth, now? Not that I mind as I always liked the concept, but I thought the Beyonders had moved it away in the 80s (and a quick look on Wikipedia tells me it was destroyed by Thanos, then replaced by a new one, which was also destroyed by Thanos). Also, I hate the retcon of a retcon of a retcon that now makes Pietro and Wanda not being Magneto's children, and perhaps not even mutants. Odd that Wanda looks so much like Magda, Magneto's deceased wife… Odd that all the sentinels who met the pair over the years marked them as mutants… Odd that Pietro's and Magneto's hairline looks so similar (and that they both had prematurely white hair). Odd that Pietro was depowered by a spell that targeted mutants during M-Day, and that Cerebro can find them. Odd that I waste time over the concept that modern and supposedly .serious" comic-books should make sense! There have been several by then even. The latest one I remember was the Heroes Reborn world (this was near the end of volume 1 of Thunderbolts). And I always found it odd that the retconned the Whizzer into not being their father. Really, a superspeedster's wife gives birth in the same exact place at the exact time as another woman and one of the children of the other woman has superspeed powers? (And didn't the Whizzer also have white hair or is that only the Squadron Supreme one? And Wanda's hair looks pretty similar to Miss America's.) They did maker Whizzer their dad, in the Vision & Scarlet Witch miniseries, but that particular retcon was itself retconned away when the Magneto story popped up. |
|
|
|
Post by Dizzy D on Jan 22, 2015 14:54:01 GMT -5
Which is exactly my point, I stop caring about continuity a long, long time ago. It just seems so pointless to link and unlink characters all the time.
|
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 22, 2015 14:59:16 GMT -5
They did maker Whizzer their dad, in the Vision & Scarlet Witch miniseries, but that particular retcon was itself retconned away when the Magneto story popped up. I knew it! I knew I wasn't misremembering! And the golden age Miss America was supposed to be their mom. But I cannot recall exactly if Whizzer was written as their biological father or adopted? I can recheck my book, but I do not recall off the top of my head. |
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 22, 2015 15:27:21 GMT -5
Superior Iron Man is not really an enjoyable read as they've made Tony too much of a dick This, exactly. Superior Spider-Man was so good because you knew the characters was a dick trying to be a hero, but doing it in a dickish way. Here you have a good character just being a dick - it's not the same! The book has been terrrible so far - it's just depressing to read. |
|
The Captain
CCF Mod Squad
Posts: 4,916
Member is Online
|
Post by The Captain on Jan 22, 2015 15:48:09 GMT -5
Superior Iron Man is not really an enjoyable read as they've made Tony too much of a dick This, exactly. Superior Spider-Man was so good because you knew the characters was a dick trying to be a hero, but doing it in a dickish way. Here you have a good character just being a dick - it's not the same! The book has been terrrible so far - it's just depressing to read. A big problem I have with it is that it seems to have a limited shelf life. I just don't see where they're going to go with it after this first story arc is done, but that is probably been the plan all along. Keep an "Iron Man" book on the schedule, with the full knowledge that it is going to be wiped out when Secret Wars happens and they can start over. I agree with you that it is depressing. I rarely ever drop a book, but this is really close to getting the axe. |
|
|
|
Post by Paste Pot Paul on Jan 22, 2015 16:21:28 GMT -5
I was kind of interested as I've said that really something of this level is what it would take to interest me in Marvel again, but, after reading Newsarama's countdown speculation on Battleworld, I realize I'm already lost and confused and, most importantly, don't care anymore. I don't. When Disney bought Marvel, I knew something like this would be coming. Really, my Marvel has been next to nothing for about 10-15 years now. In the 90's when their product was SO bad and they were selling to speculators and crazy variant covers, the insides were crap. We few exceptions, like Marvels and PAD's Hulk, I bought almost no Marvel. When Quesada & Palmiotti came on with Marvel Knights, they started to get me back. Heroes Reborn too, but it didn't last. I'm not interested in this mish mash at all. This is the final stroke and I'm fine with it as it's been a long time coming. I've heard all the hate over the years from fanboys who left after a. Crisis, b. Identity Crisis, and esp c. Nu52, but have never felt that way. I look at it more as a metamorphosis and roll with it, though some of the details are flawed. Marvel has insulted me as a DC reader for years, as well as my loyalty and intelligence, and this is the last straw. If they produce stand alone, out of continuity stories with characters I recognize, there's a good chance I'd try that, but not Battleworld mish mash ever. Good chance for me to continue filling in the gaps in my True Marvel collection, continue with DC, and support the great indie stuff out there like Image, Dark Horse, Valiant (a great cohesive superhero universe), Dynamite, Archie/Dark Circle, the return of Milestone Media, etc. It may sound hypocritical of me to follow Convergence, but that's not cherry picking. It's the exact opposite : it's all in and fully integrating everything that's ever existed, i.e. imaginary stories, Elseworlds, different earths, characters, dimensions, aliens caging Golden Age Batman & Robin, etc, all in the super-megaverse of the largest tapestry. A universe where Shazam pre-FP exists, Captain Thunder and Thunderworld exists, and Shazam ! by Geof Johns & Gary Frank exists. Yeah, I have no problems with that at all. So let me get this straight, both Marvel and DC havent started their new Events, we dont actually know what they have planned, yet from a websites "speculation" as you put it, you will no longer support Marvel because they intend to bring their old and new universes together. BUT You will support DC because they intend to bring their old and new universes together. ...walks off...shaking head...brain exploding... |
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 22, 2015 16:22:02 GMT -5
I already miss the hell out of ANXF.
And now Amazing X-Men is doing some Colossus/Juggernaut thing, and I couldn't really care less about either character.
*sigh*
|
|
|
|
Post by hondobrode on Jan 22, 2015 16:27:48 GMT -5
I was kind of interested as I've said that really something of this level is what it would take to interest me in Marvel again, but, after reading Newsarama's countdown speculation on Battleworld, I realize I'm already lost and confused and, most importantly, don't care anymore. I don't. When Disney bought Marvel, I knew something like this would be coming. Really, my Marvel has been next to nothing for about 10-15 years now. In the 90's when their product was SO bad and they were selling to speculators and crazy variant covers, the insides were crap. We few exceptions, like Marvels and PAD's Hulk, I bought almost no Marvel. When Quesada & Palmiotti came on with Marvel Knights, they started to get me back. Heroes Reborn too, but it didn't last. I'm not interested in this mish mash at all. This is the final stroke and I'm fine with it as it's been a long time coming. I've heard all the hate over the years from fanboys who left after a. Crisis, b. Identity Crisis, and esp c. Nu52, but have never felt that way. I look at it more as a metamorphosis and roll with it, though some of the details are flawed. Marvel has insulted me as a DC reader for years, as well as my loyalty and intelligence, and this is the last straw. If they produce stand alone, out of continuity stories with characters I recognize, there's a good chance I'd try that, but not Battleworld mish mash ever. Good chance for me to continue filling in the gaps in my True Marvel collection, continue with DC, and support the great indie stuff out there like Image, Dark Horse, Valiant (a great cohesive superhero universe), Dynamite, Archie/Dark Circle, the return of Milestone Media, etc. It may sound hypocritical of me to follow Convergence, but that's not cherry picking. It's the exact opposite : it's all in and fully integrating everything that's ever existed, i.e. imaginary stories, Elseworlds, different earths, characters, dimensions, aliens caging Golden Age Batman & Robin, etc, all in the super-megaverse of the largest tapestry. A universe where Shazam pre-FP exists, Captain Thunder and Thunderworld exists, and Shazam ! by Geof Johns & Gary Frank exists. Yeah, I have no problems with that at all. So let me get this straight, both Marvel and DC havent started their new Events, we dont actually know what they have planned, yet from a websites "speculation" as you put it, you will no longer support Marvel because they intend to bring their old and new universes together. BUT You will support DC because they intend to bring their old and new universes together. ...walks off...shaking head...brain exploding... Here's what they're doing. Marvel's cherry picking from all the versions of their characters. From the speculative article, it appears I'm not interested in what they're cherry picking, hence, not interested in following it. DC is NOT cherry picking. They're including everything that's every existed, Elseworlds and all, and it's all in the DCU. Does that make sense ? |
|
|
|
Post by hondobrode on Jan 22, 2015 16:34:12 GMT -5
I checked out of the Marvel Universe in the sense of really caring around 2002. When Busiek's Avengers ended, and Byrne left in a huff off of X-Men: The Hidden Years, I just lost interest. The style of mainstream comics that Quesada was interested in pushing wasn't for me. I did return in 2007 for Planet Hulk and Annihilation, both of which I genuinely enjoyed, but I rarely found much else of interest. Not to be a broken record, but this New Marvel Universe is going to appeal to me on the basis of whether or not Marvel is serious about changing their publishing strategies. Will we continue to get poorly conceived event after event? Will we get some exciting new talent to relive the rather tired likes of Bendis' and crew? Could Marvel possibly be smart enough to give the likes of PAD, Mark Waid and Kurt Busiek (if he's interested) the reigns for awhile and let Bendis & Co. take a back seat? I'll keep an eye on the situation, but it's going to take a lot of serious changes besides the pomp and flash of a Marvel Crisis event to make me care again. Trebor, I agree exactly with this. I was along with Busiek on Avengers. When Bendis butchered it, I left. When Byrne left Hidden Years, the only mutant title I was left reading at that time, I left there too. With very few exceptions i.e. Daredevil, Agents of Atlas, the Twelve, Books of Doom, I'm down to just about zero Marvels. I've picked some up on $ 1 sales @ Comixology, like Remender's Cap or Uncanny Avengers, but that's it. If Bendis and co left, I'd be willing to look again, but that's not going to happen. Outside of Daredevil, I wouldn't touch anything Bendis works on. PAD, Waid, Busiek...sure, but I'm afraid they're not going to be there, and as far as event ceasing, I highly doubt that as well. |
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Jan 22, 2015 16:46:39 GMT -5
Remender's Cap started out great...then went to crap, imo.
And I just want Bendis off X-Men.
And Hickman off Avengers.
|
|
Roquefort Raider
CCF Mod Squad
Modus omnibus in rebus
Posts: 17,420
Member is Online
|
Post by Roquefort Raider on Jan 22, 2015 18:08:28 GMT -5
They did maker Whizzer their dad, in the Vision & Scarlet Witch miniseries, but that particular retcon was itself retconned away when the Magneto story popped up. I knew it! I knew I wasn't misremembering! And the golden age Miss America was supposed to be their mom. But I cannot recall exactly if Whizzer was written as their biological father or adopted? I can recheck my book, but I do not recall off the top of my head. He was written as their biological father. If I recall correctly, Whizzer and his wife arrived at Wundagore mountain (the High Evolutionary retreat) during a snowstorm, where the mum died in childbirth with her baby. Bova, the evolved cow who had acted as midwife, decided that this was an opportunity to get rid of a pair of twins whose mother had also recently wandered in to give birth, before running away (in another snowstorm, if memory serves). That woman had been Magda, Magneto's estranged wife. She then presented Pietro and wanda to the Whizzer as if they were his newborns, but I think he just ran away in anguish and Bova gave the babies to Django Maximoff. Phew! |
|
|
|
Post by antoine on Jan 22, 2015 18:10:35 GMT -5
So I'm as confused as anyone, and I don't really read any current Marvel comics, but would it be possible that the two "earth" (616 and the Ultimate)
collide in a battle and the result will just be a mix of both universe? So technically the 616 earth with morales as spider-man and a Samuel L. Jackson Nick Fury? Just to put their 2 universe together? Do I make sense? I'm not even sure...
|
|
|
|
Post by Slam_Bradley on Jan 22, 2015 18:13:58 GMT -5
Oddly...it's possible to wait for the books to actually come out and you know what is happening in them before pissing and moaning about what is happening in books that haven't happened yet.
|
|
