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Post by Pharozonk on Jun 13, 2014 9:17:16 GMT -5
With the start of the Nu52, DC put out two Legion titles, sending the idea to Legion fans that the Legion might once again have a chance. However, it was quickly squashed and both titles failed fairly quickly. Is another reboot necessary for the Legion to succeed? Or is it time for the franchise to sadly be laid to rest?
I also posted this on the CBR DC board, but I wanted to see what the Classics community had to say on the subject as well.
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Post by Dizzy D on Jun 13, 2014 9:42:16 GMT -5
- There is nothing wrong with the franchise by itself. Its longevity and recent success as cartoon (wait, has it already been 5 years?) prove that.
I don't think another reboot helps (but I have had to say farewell to various incarnations of the Legion over the years, so I never liked the reboots at all), but that this point I don't think it'd hurt either: new52 continuity has been pretty non-existant so far anyway.
Just give it an artist with a colourful and pleasant style and a writer that can juggle lots of characters and keep it in the future where they can be their own thing.
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Post by Pharozonk on Jun 13, 2014 9:45:15 GMT -5
I agree that another reboot is not necessary. The only reboot of the Legion that I thought came close to the original team was the post Zero Hour reboot. That era brought back the youthful energy and fun that Legion represented in the Silver/Bronze Age while bringing the team into the modern era. However, I hated any subsequent reboots of the team.
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Post by Dizzy D on Jun 13, 2014 9:59:27 GMT -5
While I didn't like the reboots themselves (the Waid runs), I did come to like the new teams; DnA on the post Zero Hour and Shooter on the 3-boot and I was incredibly annoyed by Legion of the 3 worlds mini. One of the few mini's that I dropped only a few issues in, usually I at least complete them.
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Post by fanboystranger on Jun 13, 2014 10:48:46 GMT -5
As I mentioned at CBR, I absolutely think a reboot is the wrong move. The problem, as I see it, is that the Legion has just gotten too familiar-- you get some interest for a few issues because people want to see what's changed with the reboot, but then they realize that all the changes are just cosmetic and it's the same stories being told over and over again. The Legion, with its universal-wide scope, should be a title where anything can happen. It doesn't need to be the same handful of stories told with slight variances. Basically, the last time the Legion truly felt 'new', 'surprising', and 'exciting' was in the first two years of DnA's Legion title, but even they succumbed to re-telling an old story during its third year with the "Foundations" arc.
Also-- and this is just a sad fact of the market these days-- you really need an interesting (and popular) creative team to keep a non- major franchise book alive these days. Throwing random writer A in with random Brazillian artist B isn't going to fly on anything that isn't associated with the Bat-, Super-, or Justice League franchises. (And even the JL connection is tenuous-- it didn't help Katana and Vibe.) I think Levitz was supposed to be the draw on the primary Legion of Superheroes book, but that was relying on a certain fan nostalgia. Fabian Nicenza and Pete Woods on Lost was actually a very solid team on paper, but they turned in some subpar work. (Nicieza leaving didn't help, but that NFL job is a big deal for him and his family.)
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Post by Ish Kabbible on Jun 13, 2014 11:57:11 GMT -5
I have owned and read every Legion of Super Hero comic ever printed.This includes the pre-series Superboy,Jimmy Olsen and other Superman family appearences.Every mini series as well.
I regretfully believe it has run its course. Started in what? 1959? Over a half century ago? A damn long run but its time has run out.
I can't see why any decent artist or writer would want to take on this book long run,juggling with 2 dozen players,a bunch of supporting characters and an army of villians to oppose them.All being tied down to past continuities and pre-conceptions.What a headache of an assignment.
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Post by the4thpip on Jun 13, 2014 12:15:20 GMT -5
I think they can do it if they go for the long game.
Don't have a Legion ongoing for the next 3 years but build a fan base for individual Legionnaires by producing high quality product around them.
Have Garth Ennis write a 6 issue mini series about Ultra Boy's time in a gang on Rimbor. Have Brainiac 5 replace Rip Hunter as Booster Gold's mentor in a new BG ongoing. Release an Earth-One style graphic novel that has enough room for more than 4 characters to shine.
The last few two runs did not fail because the concept is bad, they failed because the writing was boring and/or confusing and they did not seem to have a plan for the book.
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Post by wildfire2099 on Jun 13, 2014 14:01:38 GMT -5
I think a big problem is the Legion doesn't fit in the New 52... it's too positive. Justice League 3000 is a far more fitting future.
I think as long as the DCU is such a dark place, they'll be no place for the Legion.
If they were to re-start, I don't see how they could do anything but re-boot... there's nothing to build on, really. I think telling NEW stories (and maybe even changing a few characters) while doing it would be key, though. I might even get rid of the code names.. I think they're a big turn off to modern readers.
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Post by Roquefort Raider on Jun 13, 2014 14:13:47 GMT -5
I agree that another reboot is not necessary. The only reboot of the Legion that I thought came close to the original team was the post Zero Hour reboot. That era brought back the youthful energy and fun that Legion represented in the Silver/Bronze Age while bringing the team into the modern era. However, I hated any subsequent reboots of the team. I was very upset when the original Legion was rebooted afterZero Hour and it was years before I tried the title again; however, I fully agree about it recapturing the youthful energy and fun of the earlier era (pre-1985, say). I had problems with some of the retooled origins (I didn't mind Jekkie as a snake, but I hated Wildfire as a combination of two other heroes)... but when DnA came aboard, their focus on character interaction and high adventure made the Legion title a favourite again. I would have been content with that incarnation going on for good. I think returning to that Legion incarnation could work, provided DC remembered what made it a success: it was a generally optimistic book, not yet another dark one where heroes suffer and die and are maimed and see their loved ones tortured. There are plenty of those titles around anyway. The Legion is about what a grand and exciting place the future can be. (*edit* : I see that Wildfire2099 also made that point. Sorry, I didn't mean to be redundant!) The vast number of characters is also a plus, I believe. Ask a kid if he'd prefer if there were only eight Pokemon, and you'll see what I mean. |
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Post by Action Ace on Jun 13, 2014 14:26:49 GMT -5
Waid's reboots saved the Legion (for me) from the twin disasters of the 5 Year Gap and DnA eras. I say give it him for a third time!
I don't think there's anything DC can really do to revive the Legion except wait for a creative team to come up with an idea and put out the book again to see if it sells.
What I'd like to see from the Legion is a bright happy future worth saving, a team that is in their teens and Superboy (a young Clark Kent) visiting every month.
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Post by fanboystranger on Jun 13, 2014 15:00:10 GMT -5
I absolutely agree. The many characters and their various histories are what drew me to the title. I wanted to learn more about every one of them, and that lead to interesting new worlds and concepts.
The Legion needs to be expansive. Limiting it to a small handful of returning concepts defeats the adventurous spirit of the title. Imagination is what's needed, not name-checking the same old stories and enemies. (Granted, I'd argue that it's the lack of imagination, not the darker tone, that's hampered most DC titles over the past decade.)
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Post by DE Sinclair on Jun 13, 2014 16:22:57 GMT -5
I agree that another reboot is not necessary. The only reboot of the Legion that I thought came close to the original team was the post Zero Hour reboot. That era brought back the youthful energy and fun that Legion represented in the Silver/Bronze Age while bringing the team into the modern era. However, I hated any subsequent reboots of the team. I was very upset when the original Legion was rebooted afterZero Hour and it was years before I tried the title again; however, I fully agree about it recapturing the youthful energy and fun of the earlier era (pre-1985, say). I had problems with some of the retooled origins (I didn't mind Jekkie as a snake, but I hated Wildfire as a combination of two other heroes)... but when DnA came aboard, their focus on character interaction and high adventure made the Legion title a favourite again. I would have been content with that incarnation going on for good. I think returning to that Legion incarnation could work, provided DC remembered what made it a success: it was a generally optimistic book, not yet another dark one where heroes suffer and die and are maimed and see their loved ones tortured. There are plenty of those titles around anyway. The Legion is about what a grand and exciting place the future can be. (*edit* : I see that Wildfire2099 also made that point. Sorry, I didn't mean to be redundant!) The vast number of characters is also a plus, I believe. Ask a kid if he'd prefer if there were only eight Pokemon, and you'll see what I mean. In response to the portion I bolded above, it should be noted that the Legion suffered more fatalities and maiming than pretty much all the other Silver/Bronze age teams at both DC and Marvel COMBINED. Think about it: Lighting Lad lost his arm, died and was resurected, one of Triplicate Girl's bodies was killed, along with Ferro Lad, Invisible Kid, Chemical King, Karate Kid, Supergirl, and probably a couple more I'm forgetting. The difference though is that they didn't wallow in the death and destruction as is popular now. They grieved (actually shown a lot of times) and moved on. |
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Post by Roquefort Raider on Jun 13, 2014 16:42:39 GMT -5
Waid's reboots saved the Legion (for me) from the twin disasters of the 5 Year Gap and DnA eras. I say give it him for a third time!. Twin disasters? Egad! Those are my favorite Legion eras!!! Granted, the 5 years later storyline overdid it with the doom and gloom, but up to the point Earth blows up it was brilliant. And DnA had no idea of how evolution works, but they had a great run! (Far better, IMO, than the post-crisis Levitz run). Strangely enough, even if we disagree on these comics, I fully agree with you about what a new Legion title should entail. And I'd love to see the one, true Superboy be a member again. Not a clone, not a pocket universe guy: Clark Kent, young, and traveling to the future. |
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Post by Deleted on Jun 13, 2014 17:07:30 GMT -5
Maybe a mini-series would work better than a continuing series?
I've never been a fan of the Legion so it's unlikely DC can make it attractive to me, but still, it's sad to see another title biting the dust.
Batman has its classic dissidents...but is at least sustaining itself with new readers who like it...apparently the Legion is just not stepping up in similar fashion.
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Post by dupersuper on Jun 13, 2014 20:08:33 GMT -5
Good writers and popular artists...?
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