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Post by tarkintino on May 22, 2021 18:17:47 GMT -5
^ that's not accurate. factor in the B&W version too. it was streamed way more than WW. (not sure what the KvG numbers were, but it passed WW before the B&W version option was added) WW and Kong out performed it according to every source out there, that's a flat fact. And the black and white version was hardly streamed at all. I'm not equating this to anything related to quality mind you, I'm just saying that it wasn't some massive success powered by legions of fans. WB was hoping this was the next Stranger Things or Mandalorian and that the Snyder cut would likewise fully capture the pop culture zeitgeist and put HBO Max on the map like Netflix and Disney +. They even planned a limited theatrical release for the summer when they hoped covid theater reluctance would have passed....but the popularity didn't meet expectations so the theatrical release has been called off. This isn't to say I think releasing the Snyder cut was a bad idea, I'm glad we got to see his original vision even if I ultimately thought it was only slightly less flawed than the theatrical cut but whether you liked it or not it is undeniable that it was not the huge success it was hoped to be for HBO Max. From the business sites I've come across (instead of geek sites, where clickbait often replaces real news), JL not only was a success for HBO-Max, but broke streaming records elsewhere, such as China, and the important thing to remember is that this is for a director's cut of a film released years ago. When I compare that to a recently released film such as Wonder Woman 1984--and its failure to not only match the box office of the original, but was a major flop, failing to earn its budget back (166 million against a 200 million-dollar budget), it illustrates which DC property caught the interest of fans/audiences between the two. |
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Post by thwhtguardian on May 23, 2021 18:20:43 GMT -5
WW and Kong out performed it according to every source out there, that's a flat fact. And the black and white version was hardly streamed at all. I'm not equating this to anything related to quality mind you, I'm just saying that it wasn't some massive success powered by legions of fans. WB was hoping this was the next Stranger Things or Mandalorian and that the Snyder cut would likewise fully capture the pop culture zeitgeist and put HBO Max on the map like Netflix and Disney +. They even planned a limited theatrical release for the summer when they hoped covid theater reluctance would have passed....but the popularity didn't meet expectations so the theatrical release has been called off. This isn't to say I think releasing the Snyder cut was a bad idea, I'm glad we got to see his original vision even if I ultimately thought it was only slightly less flawed than the theatrical cut but whether you liked it or not it is undeniable that it was not the huge success it was hoped to be for HBO Max. From the business sites I've come across (instead of geek sites, where clickbait often replaces real news), JL not only was a success for HBO-Max, but broke streaming records elsewhere, such as China, and the important thing to remember is that this is for a director's cut of a film released years ago. When I compare that to a recently new film such as Wonder Woman 1984--and its failure to no only match the box office of the original, but was a major flop, failing to earn its budget back (166 million against a 200 million-dollar budget), it illustrates which DC property caught the interest of fans/audiences between the two. ...you do realize there is no real box office to speak of yet right? Though it did get a theatrical release it was basically a limited release because of just how few states and cities were allowing theaters to be open. And I really don't know what sites you're reading because again, literally every, single, legitimate source of the Q1 earnings call clearly and unequivocally state that Kong and WW handily beat Justice League. Again, I'm not saying this as a measure of quality, that's obviously subjective, I'm just pointing out that these are actual numbers...and they fly in the face of the idea that there are "legions" of fans who wanted the Snyder cut and that they have made it a massive success. |
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Post by tarkintino on May 27, 2021 19:00:11 GMT -5
Studios do not invest tens of millions into a four-hour version of a previously released film if there's no financial justification for it, which only happened because it was answering the calls of innumerable fans who wanted to see it.
WW84 was a new film and failed to a major degree. We're talking about DC properties, and between the two, its easy to see which one had more fan interest.
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Post by impulse on May 28, 2021 9:29:53 GMT -5
WW84 was a new film and failed to a major degree. We're talking about DC properties, and between the two, its easy to see which one had more fan interest. I was mostly with you on the first part, but I think you're really reaching here unless you have solid numbers of tickets/streams to compare here. Even then. the impact of COVID on box office metrics cannot be overstated, and I suspect WW84 would have done very differently in a normal year. I can't prove it, but I think WW84 would have had strong sales the first weekend or two in a normal year and then would have dropped off after word of mouth on how dreadful it was came out. I think a solo Wonder Woman movie carried enough weight with the general public to have done solidly if not as well as the first one. Whereas the Snyder cut pretty much always had a smaller but more invested fanbase. But, I still maintain that trying to compare a first-run theatrical movie with a direct-to-streaming alternate version of a five-year-old movie that with a lukewarm-at-best critical reception is a fool's errand. |
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Post by thwhtguardian on May 28, 2021 16:45:37 GMT -5
Studios do not invest tens of millions into a four-hour version of a previously released film if there's no financial justification for it, which only happened because it was answering the calls of innumerable fans who wanted to see it. WW84 was a new film and failed to a major degree. We're talking about DC properties, and between the two, its easy to see which one had more fan interest. You said you had all kinds of articles that showed how the Snyder cut was a huge win for HBO Max and broke all kinds of records but now you're back to going with vague justifications? Which is it, your opinion on the size of fan bases or actual objective measurements? |
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Post by String on Sept 7, 2021 22:27:40 GMT -5
Today, the Snyder Cut of the film was released on blu-ray/DVD/4k HD.
I went to my local Wal-Mart with the intention of buying it; of finally watching this oh-so-grandiose epic that every fanboy has (apparently) been clamoring for and had loved the very minute it was finally released online.
I saw it there on the rack, nice front cover for it, tad dark for my taste but still highly dramatic and imposing. And yet......standing there looking at Superman, Old Man Batman with Wonder Woman front & center on the cover (no surprise), I just couldn't bring myself to buy it. I just don't like the film nor any of Snyder's DC films.
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Post by wildfire2099 on Sept 8, 2021 9:22:59 GMT -5
I hear you there... I swapped from Disney Plus over to HBO for a bit, and that was one of the things I planned on watching while waiting for the next Star Wars series.
After the horror of the Titans TV show(my daughter my convince me to watch another episode or two, but maybe not), and looking at that dark, gloomy cover pic, just haven't been motivated yet.
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Post by tarkintino on Sept 11, 2021 19:22:46 GMT -5
I bought the Snyder Cut and enjoy it as much as I did when first released on HBO. A breath of fresh air that does not fill every frame (including serious scenes) with quips as if it was a sitcom, like certain comic book movies.
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Post by wildfire2099 on Sept 24, 2021 8:48:15 GMT -5
OK, so I watched it. The main story is decent, a bit boring, to be honest. Definitely didn't need to be 4 hours... like a 1/2 hour (so it seemed) of Lois Lane brooding. The stuff with Luthor also seemed totally useless. LOTS of future set up that probably would never get used.. like why use Deathstroke like that at the end, when he's so tied into the Titans?
Batman having 'visions' and talking about having faith? What? Those visions seem to have no purpose but to test possibilities for the sequel... that seems like 'extra' stuff, not part of the movie. It was fun seeing Kilowog in the pan out of the destroyed Hall of Justice though, even if that just pointed out how there SHOULD have been a Green Lantern around (even if it's Abin Sur or some other alien and not Hal)
They could have used him, instead of having to but Batman in random indestructible vehicles to keep up.
Cyborg was MASSIVELY powered up... too much, I think, so that he turned into a walking Deus Ex Machina.
Flash was fun... even if they did a weird thing with making it Barry's back story with Wally's age and personality. I actually wonder if I would have liked the original better... shorter and less.. heavy sounds good to me.
Perhaps he would have been more meaningful if I'd watched the Aquaman movie, but he could have been totally edited out with nothing lost. I get they were going for the 'uniting the defenders of the Earth' thing, but he did very little to contribute but look menace and deliver grumpy quips.
Then there's the ending.... I feel like I missed the movie I wanted to see... we get a scene with Cyborg, Mera, Batman, Deathstroke, Flash and Joker in a post-apocalyptic world... talking about how everyone else died... but fighting Superman? Isn't that Injustice? Were they thinking of going there?
It was cool to have J'onn at the end, though.. even if it made little sense.
Seems unlikely at this point they'll ever actually make the promised sequel though (which is really the 2nd half of the story)... which is too bad, because the action scenes were the strength of the movie for sure, and there would have been plenty of those.
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Post by impulse on Oct 1, 2021 16:42:42 GMT -5
For years and years, I've thought the "Superman, the symbol of hope and goodness, retires and goes away until our darkest moment when hope is lost, and then... HE'S BACK!" story was one of the most emotionally powerful tools DC has in it shelf, and they just don't seem to want to use it. I thought it was used to great effect in Kingdom Come, but even there I thought that part of the story was more interesting than the back plot.
I wish this movie would have focused more on that. That is the untapped emotional goldmine the DCEU could have nailed. Unfortunately, that's not really what Snyder set up with is earlier movies. While I enjoyed them well enough, making Superman the alien other power to fear was IMO a mistake. Let Superman be a powerful symbol of hope.
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Post by tarkintino on Oct 3, 2021 20:48:47 GMT -5
For years and years, I've thought the "Superman, the symbol of hope and goodness, retires and goes away until our darkest moment when hope is lost, and then... HE'S BACK!" story was one of the most emotionally powerful tools DC has in it shelf, and they just don't seem to want to use it. I thought it was used to great effect in Kingdom Come, but even there I thought that part of the story was more interesting than the back plot. I wish this movie would have focused more on that. That is the untapped emotional goldmine the DCEU could have nailed. Unfortunately, that's not really what Snyder set up with is earlier movies. While I enjoyed them well enough, making Superman the alien other power to fear was IMO a mistake. Let Superman be a powerful symbol of hope. Superman recognized / feared as an alien has its roots in the comics, and its a better way to build the character on the road to becoming a hero than having the world instantly accepting him (which they would not in real life) and feeling safe around something with no connection to humans being so powerful. |
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Post by impulse on Oct 3, 2021 21:46:16 GMT -5
For years and years, I've thought the "Superman, the symbol of hope and goodness, retires and goes away until our darkest moment when hope is lost, and then... HE'S BACK!" story was one of the most emotionally powerful tools DC has in it shelf, and they just don't seem to want to use it. I thought it was used to great effect in Kingdom Come, but even there I thought that part of the story was more interesting than the back plot. I wish this movie would have focused more on that. That is the untapped emotional goldmine the DCEU could have nailed. Unfortunately, that's not really what Snyder set up with is earlier movies. While I enjoyed them well enough, making Superman the alien other power to fear was IMO a mistake. Let Superman be a powerful symbol of hope. Superman recognized / feared as an alien has its roots in the comics, and its a better way to build the character on the road to becoming a hero than having the world instantly accepting him (which they would not in real life) and feeling safe around something with no connection to humans being so powerful. After 80 years of comics, I doubt there is much of anything that hasn't been done in the comics by this point, and I don't agree that it's a better way to build these movies. This isn't a new character anymore. Everyone knows who he is and what he stands for, and going with the terrifying alien monster thing adds weight to the criticism of much of Snyder's work being grimdark. Scary alien other monstrous feared Superman seems like an antithetical take in the 21st century. That's not what Superman is known for these days nor is it what I think the majority of fans want from him. Side note, there's plenty of stuff that has roots in the comics that would make for a terrible movie in 2021, so something having some roots in the comics isn't really much of a selling point on its own. |
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Post by majestic on Jan 3, 2022 22:58:09 GMT -5
Finally saw it and enjoyed it much more than the version released to theaters. Sure there was some rough spots but overall I think this version would have done better released in 2 parts to theaters.
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