|
|
Post by Hoosier X on Dec 9, 2023 9:01:56 GMT -5
About 10 years ago, I purchased a batch of very low-grade issues of Lois Lane from the early 1970s, and most of them had the Rose and Thorn back-up feature. Among them was the first part of the storyline where the 100 had hired Poison Ivy to come to Metropolis to kill the Thorn. I remember being very surprised when I looked it up online to find out that it was her third appearance. And then I did a little more digging and discovered that the first comic book where I ever saw her, Batman #291, was only her ninth appearance! And only third appearance in a Batman title. I haven’t read the story but know OF it…. It’s a 4 parter where different villains talk about how they killed Batman. I know she’s not a major character but does she interact with Batman at all? There was a Gene Colan Batman vs Poison Ivy story in the early 80s. Is that the third time she fought Batman not as part of a team? My thesis is sound! I haven’t read the Thorn story either, but that pairing makes good thematic sense. Was P I still in pure femme fatale mode? 1. In the classic “Where Were You on the Night Batman Was Killed?” storyline, Ivy was on the jury with Mr. Freeze, Scarecrow, the Mad Hatter, Signal-Man and the Spook. She doesn’t have any other role aside from being on the jury. In one of the issues, she leaps up and unilaterally declares “Not Guilty!” for one of the villains, presuming to speak for the rest of the jury. 2. There are actually three Gene Colan issues where he drew Poison Ivy! All three Colan issues were parts of storylines that went on for a few issues. The first was in #339, #343 and #344, Irv Novick drew the first part and Colan drew the last two parts. Then Ivy returned for a two-part story in Batman #367 and Detective #534. (This would be first time I saw Ivy as a solo villain, not part of a group.) Colan drew one part and Don Newton drew the other. And you’re right. The story in #339, #343 and #344 would be only the third time Ivy took on Batman as a solo villain. 3. In the Thorn story, Ivy has been hired by the 100 to kill the Thorn. She’s not using plant-themed weapons yet. There is no sign of any altruistic environmental motives. It hasn’t been that long since I read it, but I still can’t remember exactly what happened. 4. I thought of a story that’s not been mentioned that might have given her a slightly higher profile. There was a Secret Society of Super-Villains special at the same time as the “Where Were You the Night Batman Was Killed?” storyline. There was a splinter group of the society, that was seeking revenge on Superman, Batman, Flash, Green Lantern and Wonder Woman. The villains were Bizarro, Grodd, Sinestro, the Angle Man. And Ivy was the Batman villain. So that’s pretty good for her status, being ranked with Bizarro, Grodd and Sinestro. |
|
|
|
Post by Hoosier X on Dec 9, 2023 9:04:42 GMT -5
Huh. The timeline checks out and the first Poison Ivy story did introduce four female villains. Three other female villains "appeared" in the story, but only as paintings. I don't think those characters ever appeared in a story.  They appear later in the story in Batman #181. It’s chaotic and wonderful. |
|
|
|
Post by foxley on Dec 9, 2023 9:20:30 GMT -5
Three other female villains "appeared" in the story, but only as paintings. I don't think those characters ever appeared in a story. They appear later in the story in Batman #181. It’s chaotic and wonderful. They also turn up in Batman #670 in 2007, 41 years after their first appearance, in what is mostly an inside joke for fans.
|
|
|
|
Post by codystarbuck on Dec 9, 2023 19:17:03 GMT -5
Ivy also turned up in the Secret Origins of Super-Villains Limited collector's Edition, in a center spread pin-up, of a group of villains, but doesn't appear in any stories. The villains depicted are primarily Flash and Batman enemies and there are other villains not seen in stories within the collection.  The Flash has the greatest representation, with Batman second, followed by Captain Marvel and Superman lagging behind even The Big Red Cheese. |
|
|
|
Post by jester on Dec 9, 2023 20:19:57 GMT -5
She was also a planned Legion of Doom member, at a time when she'd only had a couple of comics appearances, one of three Bat-villains along with Joker and Penguin, with Riddler and Scarecrow, the two they ended up going with, absent in this proposal. Interestingly, there's a lot of crossover between that pinup Cody posted and LOD membership, both final and proposed.  |
|
|
|
Post by foxley on Dec 9, 2023 20:47:28 GMT -5
She was also a planned Legion of Doom member, at a time when she'd only had a couple of comics appearances, one of three Bat-villains along with Joker and Penguin, with Riddler and Scarecrow, the two they ended up going with, absent in this proposal. Interestingly, there's a lot of crossover between that pinup Cody posted and LOD membership, both final and proposed. Hanna-Barbera went with the Riddler and the Scarecrow for the Legion of Doom because, at the time, Filmation had the rights to the Joker and the Penguin as they were using them in The New Adventures of Batman. (Oddly, the Riddler appeared in the opening credits of that show (in a red costume!) but never in the show itself.)
That is an awesome piece of art. Is that Ras's al-Ghul seated beside the Penguin? And who is the blonde on the other side of Penguin?
|
|
|
|
Post by jester on Dec 9, 2023 22:06:05 GMT -5
That is an awesome piece of art. Is that Ras's al-Ghul seated beside the Penguin? And who is the blonde on the other side of Penguin?
It's Alex Toth art, no less. That's Abra Kadabra sitting next to Penguin. The blonde has been identified as Beautia Sivana, the Doc's daughter. |
|
|
|
Post by Chris on Dec 9, 2023 23:53:25 GMT -5
the classic “Where Were You on the Night Batman Was Killed?” Since two different people mentioned it, I'm gonna state that Batman #293 is one of the greatest comics of all time. I'm also going to claim it's relevant to this thread because Lex Luthor didn't fight Batman very often. |
|
|
|
Post by Reptisaurus! on Dec 10, 2023 0:27:41 GMT -5
Isn't she more associated with Batman because of the Batman tv show from the 60s? I think I once read that they wanted more female villains and she was specifically created to answer that call. Although she never actually made it onto the show, Ivy was considered. One of the Catwoman episodes featured a villain sidekick played by Lesley Gore who was originally Ivy in script drafts before being made into a different character. She was largely cemented as a key Batman villain post-Crisis. A lot of classic villains really didn't appear much in their associated character's books, and adaptations in animation and film are what boosted their profiles. Mr. Freeze only had a handful of pre-Crisis appearances. Yeah, thank you! I was, like, 80% sure that Rags was correct that Ivy was intended for the Batman show. |
|
|
|
Post by Reptisaurus! on Dec 10, 2023 0:31:10 GMT -5
They appear later in the story in Batman #181. It’s chaotic and wonderful. They also turn up in Batman #670 in 2007, 41 years after their first appearance, in what is mostly an inside joke for fans.
That’s beautiful. I was vaguely aware they had turned up again - I was researching Poison Ivy so obviously I spent half a. Hour googling “Silken Spider + Batman”) but that’s another story I never got around to reading. |
|
|
|
Post by Deleted on Dec 10, 2023 7:33:28 GMT -5
When I think Poison Ivy, this is really what comes to mind. I love my old comics dearly and usually prefer classic renditions of characters, but in Ivy's case, she really benefitted from the modern era IMO.  |
|
|
|
Post by zaku on Dec 10, 2023 9:03:43 GMT -5
Ivy also turned up in the Secret Origins of Super-Villains Limited collector's Edition, in a center spread pin-up, of a group of villains, but doesn't appear in any stories. The villains depicted are primarily Flash and Batman enemies and there are other villains not seen in stories within the collection. The Flash has the greatest representation, with Batman second, followed by Captain Marvel and Superman lagging behind even The Big Red Cheese. We had a discussion somewhere on this forum that Superman in the 70s didn't have a real "rogue gallery". I have to find it! |
|
|
|
Post by Icctrombone on Dec 10, 2023 9:26:15 GMT -5
It feels like PI never really came alive until she was paired with Harley Quinn and made a lesbian.
|
|
|
|
Post by Hoosier X on Dec 10, 2023 9:47:29 GMT -5
It feels like PI never really came alive until she was paired with Harley Quinn and made a lesbian. For those of us who have been reading Batman since 1975, that’s not even remotely accurate. |
|
|
|
Post by Icctrombone on Dec 10, 2023 9:51:54 GMT -5
It feels like PI never really came alive until she was paired with Harley Quinn and made a lesbian. For those of us who have been reading Batman since 1975, that’s not even remotely accurate. I mean to the general public. Comic geeks don't count. |
|
